Macross Delta - Episode 7 Discussion / Poll

[charles883]

We NOT sure what FULL story behind that incident. My theory is there third party involve

[LoweGear]

Originally Posted by Benigmatica

On the other hand, using dimensional weapons to gain their independence and blame the New United Nations for it was utterly wrong! I mean, the Windermereans' misuse of those dimensional weapons have caused their lifespan to dwindle to just 30 years (if proven).

The Windermerians having a 30-year average lifespan is one of their aspects that have been around long before the UN came around. According to the supplemental info we know of them, the Windermerians only became introduced to the concept of long life when they encountered the UN. As already mentioned in the show itself, Windermerian biology is such that they are physically more capable (see Freyja's jumping capability, or Bogue's 'practice' against Hermann), but in exchange their natural lifespans are shorter compared to other races.

Keep in mind of course that 30 is only the average, not a hard limit: Hermann himself is a noted outlier being 33, and I don't doubt there are Windermerians that are 35 or even 40 years old, much like how modern day humans have a 70-year life expectancy, and yet we have 80, 90, and even 100 year olds among us.

[Thess]

Originally Posted by kuromitsu

So I'm watching the episode and did Mikumo just do a kabe-don to Freyja? Unf~ those two should just kiss already...

(what? this is an important plot element)

I agree. The sexual tension is far much. Goddamn it Hayate who just had to interrupt when it was getting good (got a laugh when Mikumo just ignores him and Mirage and only focuses on Freyja ).

I'm loving this "mystery of the Protoculture" plot approach and zero romantic development to the so-called "triangle." Honestly, it'll be better if the three remain as good friends. None of them had actual chemistry as lovers.

[kuromitsu]

Originally Posted by Thess

I agree. The sexual tension is far much. Goddamn it Hayate who just had to interrupt when it was getting good (got a laugh when Mikumo just ignores him and Mirage and only focuses on Freyja ).

I'm loving this "mystery of the Protoculture" plot approach and zero romantic development to the so-called "triangle." Honestly, it'll be better if the three remain as good friends. None of them had actual chemistry as lovers.

Seriously, Mikumo is behaving more like a typical love interest to Freyja than Hayate. But yes, I also find the approach to the "romance" refreshing so far - I think Hayate and Freyja have a really cute friendship going on, and he has a fun work relationship with Mirage too (now that they moved on from being antagonistic), but I'm actually dreading the introduction of the romantic elements. It's going so well now, don't ruin it with romance drama! Let them stay friends!

[ReddyRedWolf]

Originally Posted by Benigmatica

Windermereans involved in Protoculture, huh? Not only that, but they're the rightful heirs despite the Protoculture manipulated genes of sentient beings across galaxies and sometimes provide music for Lynn Minmay to sing.

On the other hand, using dimensional weapons to gain their independence and blame the New United Nations for it was utterly wrong! I mean, the Windermereans' misuse of those dimensional weapons have caused their lifespan to dwindle to just 30 years (if proven).

No their lifespan is usually 30 years. Hermann is pushing 33.

From Newtype article:

ウィンダミア人にしてみると、約40年前に地球人類と接触する前は、自分たちの寿命が短いとは 思っていなか ったんです。
ところが突然、進んだテクノロジーを持ち、なおかつ寿命が長い種族がウィンダミアにやってきた 。
でも、身体能力は高くないし、『ルン』も持っていない。この差は何なんだと。
なぜ自分たちは早く死ななくてはいけないんだろうかと。彼らは複雑な思いを感じているはずなん ですね。

From the Windermereians' point of view 40 years ago, before they encountered humanity, they did not think that their life spans were "short." However, out of nowhere, a race with advanced technology, as well as a long lifespan arrived onto Windermere. However, their physical abilities weren't high, and they did not possess "run." They must have had confusing and complex thoughts such as why did they (the Windermereians) have to die so quickly.

As we can see from Voldor's point of view there is no unequal treaty with the tech uplift.

Windermerean nationalists and nobility just has this inferiority complex compared with the rest of the Children of the Protoculture as to their lifespans despite being physically stronger. Especially with Humans who are blessed from their point of view with luck. Well humanity doesn't see it as luck they are just doing it to survive and letting others join them so they can survive.

Originally Posted by charles883

We NOT sure what FULL story behind that incident. My theory is there third party involve

Like there was a third party with SDF Macross, Macross Plus, Macross 7, and Macross Zero?

Do not assume Delta is a Frontier clone. Windermere is doing terrible shit with mind control. Heck their government restricting travel and cracking down on Earth culture.

It only takes some characters to turn against their side like Vrlitwhai's Zentradi, Gigil and Sivil, and Brera.

No need for a nebulous third party late in the game.

[Benigmatica]

Okay, so the Windermereans' lifespan was not affected by using dimensional weapons. Then again, the Protoculture should have give them longer lifespan instead of being 30.

[ReddyRedWolf]

Originally Posted by Benigmatica

Okay, so the Windermereans' lifespan was not affected by using dimensional weapons. Then again, the Protoculture should have give them longer lifespan instead of being 30.

Why? So they can be like the Zentradi who were also enhanced?

The Protoculture nerfed Earther's Fold Receptor ability else they'd have access to bio weapons like the Bird Human and Evil Series Yurva Arga.

The Protodevlin realized they needed Humans particularly Basara to have a perpetual energy source. Basara taught them they don't need to as they can produce it themselves.

The Bird Human needed Sara Nome who had Fold Receptor ability to regenerate and activate.

In Macross 30 Col. Todo kidnapped songstresses across time so that their Song Energy would power and activate Yurva Arga so he can change the timeline where Earth was spared.

edit:

Images

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

Somebody in MW spotted this.

Well Cat Girl appeared again. You have to wonder how she feels that she couldn't join Walkure and her world is taken hostage by Windermere with Var.

Will she sing like that little cat girl to her father?

[azarhal]

Originally Posted by Alhazred

Do we have a firm idea of when the Rax ruin AI was created, relative to the last throes of Protoculture civilization messing with life in the Brisingr cluster? It's not strange for a civilization/government to change its direction, beliefs or goals over time. The simple 'we were the last made, so we're the best' stance is obviously flawed, but if the special chemicals in the water and apples are a 'naturally occurring' found phenomenon rather than something the Windermere and Voldorans have done, then it might indicate that the entire star cluster is a giant terraforming/bioengineering experiment in mass producing the tools to control Protoculture-uplifted sapient life. From that perspective Roid's contention might have some teeth in the sense that, "Life in the Brisingr cluster was engineered to control the legacy the Protoculture." The likelihood that they were engineered to be tools rather than rulers is probably something he dismisses out of arrogance.

Having something in the water near Protoculture ruins that react with apples grown in that sector which allow for mind control when singing in a Protoculture ruins suggest that the Protoculture where mind controlling the natives on those planets actually, not designing those races to mind controlling everyone else.

[ReddyRedWolf]

Between the Dimension Cutters and Mind Control I think this a rare case where both Vajra and Basara are needed to be dropped on Windermere.

Vajra to contain the fold distortions of dimensional weapons. Basara to free people from Var.

Funny enough Basara is the Japanese word for Vajra.

[Benigmatica]

Wait, don't tell me that the Protoculture are evil all along? *shudder*

Well, it's just speculation on my part. Who knows, Kawamori would point out that the Protoculture are the ones manipulating sentient beings so that they could wage war against each other!

[lfhoule]

Good episode, tho' Makina may want to tone down the use of the bunny shapes when making entry ways!
One thing that caught my eye is: during the bottom of the screen scroll 16 minutes into the episode, it has in English "Live Walkure Attack!" and next Sunday's date (5/22). Are they having a live event next week, this early in the series? Granted, with the 3 new songs added with this episode, they would have enough for a decent live performance of Walkure at this point, but since I can't read Japanese...

[xeviouses]

Originally Posted by Benigmatica

Wait, don't tell me that the Protoculture are evil all along? *shudder*

Well, it's just speculation on my part. Who knows, Kawamori would point out that the Protoculture are the ones manipulating sentient beings so that they could wage war against each other!

Well, how about looking at it as a controlled experiment by the Protoculture?

To see if their creations are susceptible to external and internal mental manipulation.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by Benigmatica

Okay, so the Windermereans' lifespan was not affected by using dimensional weapons. Then again, the Protoculture should have give them longer lifespan instead of being 30.

They are also gifted with enhanced physical abilities and ability to interact with Fold. Pro and con. Can't have a cake and eat it too. The last time Protoculture attempted to create Super Saiyajin, ahem, perfect fodders, it ended up turning against them, destroyed the galaxy and left a war that only escalated beyond the boundaries of the Milky Way after the demise of Protoculture. So, maybe not a good idea?

Did I also mention that war is still going on?

And if they want better lifespan? Devote themselves to technology! Humanity can already create immortals through cybernetics.

Originally Posted by ReddyRedWolf

Between the Dimension Cutters and Mind Control I think this a rare case where both Vajra and Basara are needed to be dropped on Windermere

I don't like Basara, but I approve. While at it, bring his Super Dimension 'friends' with him!

- Tak

[Tenzen12]

Love triangle? There will never be such thing. Freya, Mirage and Hayate will form cute family instead. Hayate doting father, Mirage aloof mother and Freya their adopted daughter. I get that feeling watching first episode and now it's back.

As for Windermere, I am still giving them benefit of doubt regarding their motives and find their method acceptable as long as their reasons will sound legit enough.

[Annorax]

Dont forget the poor adorable daughter that'll die alot ealier than mommy and daddy.

Speaking of love, I am more interested in Kaname, Arad, Messer and the NyanNyan girl with the giant "asset"

[Annorax]

Holy that is alot of info
So Windamere CAN make other high-tech things beside VF, they seem to have some ships and more importantly dimension weapon, which they seem to have used on themselves... Nice job...

[Diluc]

This is a fantastic episode with some extra from our fabulous walkure's
Mikumo truly is the best girl in this series, i thought she was music eccentric but she actually concerned too with spy matter,huh

Originally Posted by LoweGear

The Windermerians having a 30-year average lifespan is one of their aspects that have been around long before the UN came around. According to the supplemental info we know of them, the Windermerians only became introduced to the concept of long life when they encountered the UN. As already mentioned in the show itself, Windermerian biology is such that they are physically more capable (see Freyja's jumping capability, or Bogue's 'practice' against Hermann), but in exchange their natural lifespans are shorter compared to other races.

Keep in mind of course that 30 is only the average, not a hard limit: Hermann himself is a noted outlier being 33, and I don't doubt there are Windermerians that are 35 or even 40 years old, much like how modern day humans have a 70-year life expectancy, and yet we have 80, 90, and even 100 year olds among us.

Windermeans whose their age beyond 30 seem has white wrinkles in their faces
notice that Hermann and the king have these, I wonder if the king is around 35 now

[Alhazred]

Originally Posted by azarhal

Having something in the water near Protoculture ruins that react with apples grown in that sector which allow for mind control when singing in a Protoculture ruins suggest that the Protoculture where mind controlling the natives on those planets actually, not designing those races to mind controlling everyone else.

That would indeed be another valid explanation for it. I just don't trust the Protoculture to limit their meddling to just one star cluster when they could easily go big- though i guess they did have the Bird Human ready just in case Humanity had to be cleansed.

[azarhal]

Originally Posted by Annorax

Holy that is alot of info
So Windamere CAN make other high-tech things beside VF, they seem to have some ships and more importantly dimension weapon, which they seem to have used on themselves... Nice job...

Those ships are another Macross Galaxy import.

And going by whom created the dimension weapons in Frontier...that's another Macross Galaxy import too.

[Tak]

Originally Posted by Alhazred

That would indeed be another valid explanation for it. I just don't trust the Protoculture to limit their meddling to just one star cluster when they could easily go big- though i guess they did have the Bird Human ready just in case Humanity had to be cleansed.

We don't know if Var was engineered by Protoculture, or if it was a new phenomenon. We do know the Wind is merely weaponizing the Var, and not responsible in creating it

Originally Posted by Annorax

Holy that is alot of info
So Windamere CAN make other high-tech things beside VF, they seem to have some ships and more importantly dimension weapon, which they seem to have used on themselves... Nice job...

Yeah, except they don't have the number. It would appear for every one Wind ship, they are controlling another dozen or so. It's rather... flimsy...

- Tak