AnimeSuki Forums

Archon_Wing · 2016-07-10, 15:19

Nah, he didn't, What actually happened was dumber, though I really don't blame you for not remembering it. Would be a waste of space.

But yea, I like how badass Sisko was without the show shoving it in your face. A lot of actions were subtle, and some not so subtle. It's something a lot of storytellers could earn.

Ds9 was definitely the top of Trek for me, barring fire demons.

monster · 2016-07-10, 15:33

I like Sisko as a captain, but I wasn't too interested with him being the emissary. As for the rest, I never really got the impression that Janeway's gender or Kim's/Chakotay's/La Forge's race was ever the main point of their respective roles. Of course, I watched these shows before I ever browsed the web on a significant basis. It wasn't until I watch some convention videos on YouTube that I realized apparently Janeway being the first female captain was a big deal to some people.

On the other hand, I thought La Forge's disability fits with the idea of technology providing a better future, along with talking computer, transporter, universal translator, oh and starship.

Quote:

Originally Posted by quigonkenny

I believe Harry Kim actually did end up getting with Seven of Nine

That was Chakotay.

Ithekro · 2016-07-10, 19:26

In theory Kim will ben captain of a starship of his own. Depending on the timeline of course.

Archon_Wing · 2016-07-10, 20:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by monster

I like Sisko as a captain, but I wasn't too interested with him being the emissary. As for the rest, I never really got the impression that Janeway's gender or Kim's/Chakotay's/La Forge's race was ever the main point of their respective roles. Of course, I watched these shows before I ever browsed the web on a significant basis. It wasn't until I watch some convention videos on YouTube that I realized apparently Janeway being the first female captain was a big deal to some people.

Yes I think that Emissary magical stuff really hurt the series. The rest? Well, I couldn't help it given all those UPN commercials pointing it out to me. Even as a 12 (13?) year old, I didn't buy it. So naturally when i see the hoopla now, I get very skeptical.

Quote:

Originally Posted by monster

On the other hand, I thought La Forge's disability fits with the idea of technology providing a better future, along with talking computer, transporter, universal translator, oh and starship.

That I think was indicative of the problem. His character was founded as a concept first, rather as a person first and didn't really evolve much beyond that, beyond his relationship with Data, which was really good, leading to the joke that Trek handles those that aren't human better.

Look at Data, a character conceived in the other direction that got a lot of interest. It's not fair I know, since outside of the big 3 of each series, the rest aren't that developed.

I mean they also got in that he was the nerdy type to find women in the holodeck; all good. But it seemed mostly jokes at his expense.

I think the biggest example is that his mother died, and beyond a token line, nobody gave a damn. And none afterwards. They killed his mother to a plot device of the week, and... that was it. That's just mean.

jdennis007 · 2016-07-12, 02:48

The problem with La Forge is that they didn't know what to do with his character once the joke got stale.

I agree that DS9 was better than most people give it credit for, it had some of the best stories in the franchise. I loved the episode where they are science fiction writers because it shows how far we have come and how much further we need to go.

FlareKnight · 2016-07-12, 19:10

It's true La Forge didn't go that far, but I still liked him as Data's friend. In that specific role he was really good. Just wasn't a character the show focused a lot on which is fine. Not every character in a show is going to get a ton of development. Some characters are more static and there for other characters to bounce off of. And even without a character arc, he still had some good episodes and moments. Getting stuck on that planet with a Romulan and having to find a way to cooperate was good. Sure, his vision was part of the episode, but there was more going on there.

It took a while before they let Chakotay be his own character rather than the "hey, remember that I'm Native American guy?" But, I think that's how it was for a lot of Star Trek series. It took a while for characters to settle in. Sometimes even visually it took a while before some characters were kind of set.

Janeway was a bit weird. She was such a Science Officer at times that I would have bought her being Captain more if during the initial episode she was a bridge officer who had to take Command because the Captain died.

And really if we're talking best Trek series...I'm still giving it to TNG

. Had some rough points, but I still think it had some of the best episodes in the franchise. DS9 was good, but I never really got into it. They did do some interesting things there though.

***CrowKenobi*** · 2016-07-12, 19:58

From the previous discussion, it looks like someone should make a Star Trek general discussion thread.

Anyway, let's return to the Beyond movie discussion, please.

FlareKnight · 2016-07-13, 12:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by CrowKenobi

From the previous discussion, it looks like someone should make a Star Trek general discussion thread.

Anyway, let's return to the Beyond movie discussion, please.

Sure! Ummm....poor Enterprise from the trailer? That poor ship

.

Ithekro · 2016-07-13, 12:36

While I can say I don't care for the new movie's Enterprise's appearance all that much, it still pains me to she her trashed (repeatedly) in these films. We've not seen this ship in a regular fight. It has so far been two huge technologically advanced ships and now a seemingly endless swarm of ramming boats.

DerGilga · 2016-07-13, 12:50

^
To be fair, that could be said about most Trek movies. The only regular battle was in ST2 and ST9.

You know, in one scene we see the Enterprise attacked by a swarm of tiny little ships and see her, or what is left of her, crashing on a foreign world. In another scene we see the crew flying into space with a new ship and escaping a swarm of tiny little things which explode....
Unless the trailer is really misleading the ending of the movie was kind of spoiled.

Rising Dragon · 2016-07-13, 13:42

Didn't they destroy the Enterprise in every other movie prior to the reboot/new timeline?

Obelisk ze Tormentor · 2016-07-13, 13:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rising Dragon

Didn't they destroy the Enterprise in every other movie prior to the reboot/new timeline?

IIRC they destroyed it in movie 3 of TOS and movie 1 of TNG. Other than that, the ship are mostly damaged to various degrees.

Ithekro · 2016-07-14, 00:38

Most TOS movies have relatively little combat. Aside from 2 and 6 most films only had a few torpedo shots, and aside from 1 and 4, the alien threat wasn't over powering to a starship, and in those cases they don't go for combat but alternative methods.

TNG movies had a bit more combat, and none of the fights ended up one sided. Close, but not one sided (Borg vs Starfleet even)

The newer films have had seeming overpowering enemies for the Enterprise. "Into Darkness" I don't think Enterprise even fired a shot. The Swarm of ram ships and boarding craft seems to be another overwhelming force. I am going to assume this was suppose to build up Kirk and his crew to become the practically legendary crew we knew them from the older series, since technically the events of these three movies takes place before the original series (in terms of the year the events are happening).

It be kind of odd if they get a new Enterprise, but it is basically the TOS ship, ready to head out again for another five year mission that just happens to fits the years of the original series.

quigonkenny · 2016-07-18, 02:57

As a longtime fan, I have less of a problem with all the hurt put on the Enterprise in the recent movies. In the original series, they were just about destroying it every other week. Any time they ran into someone new (and remember that unlike Next Gen, that was their mission), they always got their asses kicked before Kirk or one of the others found a way out of their problem.

I think that's part of the problem with the "JJ Trek" movies' reception, is that so many of the fans nowadays were brought up on TNG and only saw TOS and its movies afterwards. They're expecting TNG from these movies, but they are so much more in the spirit of the original series (not even the original series movies), warts and all.

Except Into Darkness. Into Darkness was all that mixed with a very unfortunate and poorly done rip of Wrath of Khan. Less said about it the better.

DerGilga · 2016-07-18, 03:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by quigonkenny

Except Into Darkness. Into Darkness was all that mixed with a very unfortunate and poorly done rip of Wrath of Khan. Less said about it the better.

But Into Darkness makes up 50% of the new Trek.

FlareKnight · 2016-07-18, 03:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by quigonkenny

As a longtime fan, I have less of a problem with all the hurt put on the Enterprise in the recent movies. In the original series, they were just about destroying it every other week. Any time they ran into someone new (and remember that unlike Next Gen, that was their mission), they always got their asses kicked before Kirk or one of the others found a way out of their problem.

I think that's part of the problem with the "JJ Trek" movies' reception, is that so many of the fans nowadays were brought up on TNG and only saw TOS and its movies afterwards. They're expecting TNG from these movies, but they are so much more in the spirit of the original series (not even the original series movies), warts and all.

Except Into Darkness. Into Darkness was all that mixed with a very unfortunate and poorly done rip of Wrath of Khan. Less said about it the better.

Well can't deny the whole "brought up more on TNG than TOS" myself

.

Personally much less used to seeing the Enterprise getting messed up. Not that the TNG crew never ran into troubles, but the ship didn't get totaled that often

. Minus chunks of the ship getting removed by the Borg and other events.

Although I don't think I was ever expecting TNG from these movies

. I know who the main characters are in these things. Although if they want to go more to the spirit of TNG in future films I'm totally ok with that.

Personally didn't get that into the first of these movies because I didn't care for the whole timeline messing around. I liked the Star Trek verse the way it was thanks. Into Darkness was alright. It was pretty on the nose in terms of what it was copying, but still a solid ride.

Curious to see where this movie goes. Hopefully it's pretty good.

quigonkenny · 2016-07-19, 03:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by DerGilga

But Into Darkness makes up 50% of the new Trek.

33%, now...

DerGilga · 2016-07-19, 09:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by quigonkenny

33%, now...

Oh boy, the movie is out now?!

*get's ready to go to the cinema*
*looks at the release date*

you lied to me

quigonkenny · 2016-07-19, 10:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by DerGilga

Oh boy, the movie is out now?!

*get's ready to go to the cinema*
*looks at the release date*

you lied to me

Close enough. Less than a week. And as many trailers are there are out, it has effectively entered the conversation.

DerGilga · 2016-07-21, 15:58

Quote:

After seeing the movie fuck that trailer. The movie is a good movie and good Trek!

Jokes are good!
The bike sceen is good!
Even the trailer music made sense in the movie!
Simon Pegg, you are great!

Also Sulu's gay reveal wasn't SJW nonsense but good!

2016-07-10, 19:26	Link #43
Ithekro Gamilas Falls Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Republic of California Age: 46	In theory Kim will ben captain of a starship of his own. Depending on the timeline of course. __________________

2016-07-12, 02:48	Link #45
jdennis007 Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: New York	The problem with La Forge is that they didn't know what to do with his character once the joke got stale. I agree that DS9 was better than most people give it credit for, it had some of the best stories in the franchise. I loved the episode where they are science fiction writers because it shows how far we have come and how much further we need to go. __________________ When it is a Dozen it is OK, but when it is only a Pair then somehow it's pron, think Dirty.

2016-07-12, 19:10	Link #46
FlareKnight User of the "Fast Draw" Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Canada	It's true La Forge didn't go that far, but I still liked him as Data's friend. In that specific role he was really good. Just wasn't a character the show focused a lot on which is fine. Not every character in a show is going to get a ton of development. Some characters are more static and there for other characters to bounce off of. And even without a character arc, he still had some good episodes and moments. Getting stuck on that planet with a Romulan and having to find a way to cooperate was good. Sure, his vision was part of the episode, but there was more going on there. It took a while before they let Chakotay be his own character rather than the "hey, remember that I'm Native American guy?" But, I think that's how it was for a lot of Star Trek series. It took a while for characters to settle in. Sometimes even visually it took a while before some characters were kind of set. Janeway was a bit weird. She was such a Science Officer at times that I would have bought her being Captain more if during the initial episode she was a bridge officer who had to take Command because the Captain died. And really if we're talking best Trek series...I'm still giving it to TNG . Had some rough points, but I still think it had some of the best episodes in the franchise. DS9 was good, but I never really got into it. They did do some interesting things there though. __________________ Anime-Evo

2016-07-13, 12:36	Link #49
Ithekro Gamilas Falls Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Republic of California Age: 46	While I can say I don't care for the new movie's Enterprise's appearance all that much, it still pains me to she her trashed (repeatedly) in these films. We've not seen this ship in a regular fight. It has so far been two huge technologically advanced ships and now a seemingly endless swarm of ramming boats. __________________

2016-07-13, 13:42	Link #51
Rising Dragon Goat Herder Author Join Date: Jun 2008 Age: 36	Didn't they destroy the Enterprise in every other movie prior to the reboot/new timeline? __________________

2016-07-12, 19:58	Link #47
*CrowKenobi* One PUNCH! Administrator Join Date: Dec 2005	From the previous discussion, it looks like someone should make a Star Trek general discussion thread. Anyway, let's return to the Beyond movie discussion, please.

2016-07-13, 12:50	Link #50
DerGilga Banned Join Date: Nov 2014	^ To be fair, that could be said about most Trek movies. The only regular battle was in ST2 and ST9. You know, in one scene we see the Enterprise attacked by a swarm of tiny little ships and see her, or what is left of her, crashing on a foreign world. In another scene we see the crew flying into space with a new ship and escaping a swarm of tiny little things which explode.... Unless the trailer is really misleading the ending of the movie was kind of spoiled.

2016-07-14, 00:38	Link #53
Ithekro Gamilas Falls Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Republic of California Age: 46	Most TOS movies have relatively little combat. Aside from 2 and 6 most films only had a few torpedo shots, and aside from 1 and 4, the alien threat wasn't over powering to a starship, and in those cases they don't go for combat but alternative methods. TNG movies had a bit more combat, and none of the fights ended up one sided. Close, but not one sided (Borg vs Starfleet even) The newer films have had seeming overpowering enemies for the Enterprise. "Into Darkness" I don't think Enterprise even fired a shot. The Swarm of ram ships and boarding craft seems to be another overwhelming force. I am going to assume this was suppose to build up Kirk and his crew to become the practically legendary crew we knew them from the older series, since technically the events of these three movies takes place before the original series (in terms of the year the events are happening). It be kind of odd if they get a new Enterprise, but it is basically the TOS ship, ready to head out again for another five year mission that just happens to fits the years of the original series. __________________

2016-07-18, 02:57	Link #54
quigonkenny Sav'aaq! Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Hyrule Age: 51	As a longtime fan, I have less of a problem with all the hurt put on the Enterprise in the recent movies. In the original series, they were just about destroying it every other week. Any time they ran into someone new (and remember that unlike Next Gen, that was their mission), they always got their asses kicked before Kirk or one of the others found a way out of their problem. I think that's part of the problem with the "JJ Trek" movies' reception, is that so many of the fans nowadays were brought up on TNG and only saw TOS and its movies afterwards. They're expecting TNG from these movies, but they are so much more in the spirit of the original series (not even the original series movies), warts and all. Except Into Darkness. Into Darkness was all that mixed with a very unfortunate and poorly done rip of Wrath of Khan. Less said about it the better. __________________ FGO Info: (JP) 055835281 \| クワイガンケニー ==== (EN) 952525630 \| quigonkenny