(L) Girls und Panzer Movie

[Flower]

Originally Posted by LoweGear

They are getting a lot of screentime though, particularly being the only other school that appears in the Alice War OVA.

Besides, while they may not have netted themselves a kill in the movie, their role as the eyes and ears of the team is undeniably a lot more important: the value of good intel and battlefield reconnaissance cannot be overstated.

It is true that their tanks are very well suited to gathering info....

[c933103]

From 4chan:

According to http://disp.cc/m/21-9pDS , some Russian song get replaced in HK/TW screening

According to https://www.ptt.cc/bbs/C_Chat/M.1464520773.A.6FE.html , from audio commentary, they still have no idea about how to do the world tournament. Tanks they plan to take out would be too out of the rule and would have problem in qualification.

According to https://webptt.com/m.aspx?n=bbs/C_Ch...211.A.6DE.html , from talk show http://sp.live.nicovideo.jp/gate/lv264881875 , Karl's ammunition are included inside itself, but as it's obvious that the amount of round it have exceeded what it could carry, so it's described as "Mythical space".
>"Anyway Karl is a thing full of mythical space."

To resemble BT42, they actually rided it and made a model for it

Because Aki's body is too tiny and can't reach the sight, Mika have to play the Kantele during battle which serve as an active sonar

The roller coaster tracker is 3km long

[Kazu-kun]

Originally Posted by c933103

Because Aki's body is too tiny and can't reach the sight, Mika have to play the Kantele during battle which serve as an active sonar

Man those Fins are fucking tank elves. Legolas would be proud.

[Flower]

Originally Posted by Kazu-kun

Man those Fins are fucking tank elves. Legolas would be proud.

I still remember the line in episode 2 of the tv anime where the leader of the military history buffs announces indignantly that the Stug tank they had been assigned was very helpful and to "Immediately apologize to the Finnish!"

Seems contemporary Fins in the the GuP world setting still have clout. ^^

[LoweGear]

Mind you, this is the setting where one of the electives that Oarai students can seriously take is "Ninjutsu", which was finally show in the Alice War OVA. Mika having kantele-based active sonar might not be that farfetched (although I suspect that this is just the staff trolling )

[Vallen Chaos Valiant]

Originally Posted by Flower

I still remember the line in episode 2 of the tv anime where the leader of the military history buffs announces indignantly that the Stug tank they had been assigned was very helpful and to "Immediately apologize to the Finnish!"

Seems contemporary Fins in the the GuP world setting still have clout. ^^

According to the official files the Finns actually did bring a Stug III for their 2nd round match against Black Forest. They went down figthting, but took down two Panther Gs and the scout Panzer III Ausf. J with them. They only really lost this badly because they were in sandy desert terrain that they are not familiar with.

[jasper222]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

According to the official files the Finns actually did bring a Stug III for their 2nd round match against Black Forest. They went down figthting, but took down two Panther Gs and the scout Panzer III Ausf. J with them. They only really lost this badly because they were in sandy desert terrain that they are not familiar with.

/a/ has this headcanon that she's a Shimada.
I'm tempted to believe the same.

[Infinite Zenith]

Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant

According to the official files the Finns actually did bring a Stug III for their 2nd round match against Black Forest. They went down figthting, but took down two Panther Gs and the scout Panzer III Ausf. J with them. They only really lost this badly because they were in sandy desert terrain that they are not familiar with.

According to the documentation, the girls of Continuation have some traits modelled after legendary sniper Simo Häyhä, and tend to perform best in colder conditions. In desert environment, that goes out the window.

[Top Sergeant]

Originally Posted by ForwardUntoDawn

According to the documentation, the girls of Continuation have some traits modelled after legendary sniper Simo Häyhä, and tend to perform best in colder conditions. In desert environment, that goes out the window.

That's cool!

I wonder if they will ever have the Continuation High School have an homage to Lauri Torni or Field Marshall Mannerheim. Either would be appropriate!

[LoweGear]

I wish this was the actual trailer to the movie:

YouTube

https://youtu.be/wjugcZIYRzw

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

[Peanutbutter]

Wow, what a movie. Kudos to all those involved in planning the tank battles. May need a few rewatches again to experience the awesomeness of it again.

[night_sentinel]

Originally Posted by arkhangelsk

Miho had similar thoughts to you. The results are as displayed - because she did not aggressively prosecute Nonna, she took away her kohai, her heaviest tank and her maneuver options until she was eventually destroyed.

The flag tank rule allows you to avoid problems. However, it is not always easy to know which problems are actually avoidable. And when you are under an inferiority complex and in a rush, it's easy to rationalize away the need to deal with one or two problems ... that turn out to be unavoidable.

Of course, we can say Miho was trying to educate. However, that allows us to say anything so I'm going with "Both sides may be thinking of education as a goal, but only to the extent it does not stop them from winning."

Azusa usually makes good decisions. Just look at how beautifully she handled her evasion from Saunders tanks (most people would likely rate Isobe higher, but Azusa literally evaded six times more fire and without consuming expendables) and the battle in Anzio (among other things, she managed to avoid the temptation to make the same mistake as Hippo Team made this film). But recently, she and her bunnies are under a lot of stress.

Spoiler for A Bunny History:

In the initial stages of the reformation of Oarai's tankery unit, they actually had 5 tanks with unique strengths and weaknesses so everyone can shine. Among them, the M3 Lee probably rates #2 in medium to long range firepower (at very close range, the Panzer IV climbs ahead b/c it can use Gr38s). To jump over parts of the story, they started off casual, then Ep4 happened. Most people think their "theme" is growth. I think it is the motivation of growth, which is the Struggle for Relevance which I'm sure we're all familiar with. They probably can accept they aren't the best. They do want to be useful, and not there only because there are still slots to fill.

They tried to do well in reconaissance. They actually did but there's a radio intercept balloon ... sigh, sure without that balloon there's a good chance they'll have lost. But their chance to show their good side was ruined.

As of Anzio they come of age in conventional battle. My eyes watered.

Then the Panzer IV upgraded to a L43 gun ... OK, it's the Captain, of course she gets the best tank. But then we have Ep10. Long story short ... the firepower fell from 2/5 to 6/8. Even the goddang Chi-Nu has a better gun. So, they are firmly kicked out of the firepower group through no fault of their own. OK, let's go to support, and here's where the M3's weaknesses become rather insurmountable.

Reconaissance? The thing is 3m tall and the M3's cross country isn't the best.

Long range shooting ... the long-term prospects are dim here as well. Thanks to Anzio, we know They are actually very good at it among their team, but here's the thing. The M3's scopes are unmagnified nor do they have proper stadia markings. The other teams scopes are. Many of them have flatter trajectories. The Char B1 does not but it has stereoscopic rangefinding. Sure, equipment isn't everything but if you don't assume your sempais are idiots, how would you predict this story is going to end?

Dogfighting? It has a single-radius controlled differential system, no neutral steering, and it is tall with a high center of gravity. Skill notwithstanding, it'll roll over first.

Feeling a bit bleak yet? They love their tank. In any case, Oarai seems to be unable to buy a tank to save its life and competition is strong. But it is hard to find a way to stay relevant using it.

In all this, you do realize that "Heavy Tank Killer" is kind of the only thing they have left? The proposal is not from overconfidence (like some Japanese believe), but compulsions from a sense of danger.

In any case, Miho should understand these psychological pressures, assess the real chances of success, veto the proposal, and find them something else to do. Trust in subordinates is not blind faith. Or if she is thinking about education over winning the battle, she might consider that just letting Nonna slam the hatch on her kohais' hands might not be so sharp under these circumstances.

First of all, I would like to apologize for taking some time before replying. I haven't been up online much this past few days, kinda doing some travelling due to my job.

Looking at your reply. The only point of contention is if Miho should veto or not veto Azusa and Rabbit's team plan to go after Nonna and instead assign them in holding the line along with Leopon and the others. This is because you believe that Azusa would be able to call the retreat better than Leopon could.

To be honest, while we know in hindsight that Miho giving this is a bad idea. I still can't fault Miho for not vetoing it. After all, we have the same situation in the series finale and it worked. The fact that it didn't work this time doesn't mean ceding initiative to her tank commanders is a bad idea. After all, how does Miho know Azusa didn't find a tactic that she wants to try out or notice something in the area that only the rabbit team can see because of their vantage point?

Not to mention, Miho is actively in-battle for most of the match. The fact that Miho can actually keep everything mostly on track is amazing in itself.

And since you already espoused the limitation of the M3 Lee, I would not repeat. The fact that Ooarai senshado team deserved better tank and the fact that most of the time they are in the position of psychological pressure due to tank quality is a fact of life by now. This is true for the rest of the team.

In any case, the limitation of the M3 Lee is the reason why I'm extremely doubtful if their addition to the defensive line would have added anything substantial. Of course, an additional body and gun is important but beyond that?

I'm also a bit dubious of the claim that Azusa would know how to call a retreat better than Leopon's captain. There is no in-series evidence for this. In fact, the main tank that Miho almost always used to make a defensive line is Leopon - in the series finale wherein they blocked Erika and co and twice in the this match, when they kept Pravda and co busy at different chokepoints. Rabbit team have not held a defensive line in the series as far as I know and Leopon has experience holding the line and have a tank better suited for it.

[arkhangelsk]

Originally Posted by night_sentinel

To be honest, while we know in hindsight that Miho giving this is a bad idea. I still can't fault Miho for not vetoing it. After all, we have the same situation in the series finale and it worked. The fact that it didn't work this time doesn't mean ceding initiative to her tank commanders is a bad idea. After all, how does Miho know Azusa didn't find a tactic that she wants to try out or notice something in the area that only the rabbit team can see because of their vantage point?

Here are some differences that she would know:
1) in Ep 12, she has basically lost her heavy firepower. She still has the P Tiger but she needed it as a door plug, and her Hetzer and StuG are already dead. So she had much less choice.
2) Nonna is probably a little smarter than the Jagdtiger commander.
3) In many ways, the IS-2 is actually a harder target than the Jagdtiger or Elefant. It has 90mm of rear armor (more than the Jadgtiger). It has a rotating turret. It is also more mobile.

But the most important thing is number 1.

This is true for the rest of the team.

When I wrote that, I was doing an intra-team comparison, not comparing them to outside tanks. The wierd thing is that when the 38(t) became the Hetzer, the Type 89 became the only light tank left in Oarai. Though it is weak, it actually has a significant unique role that is hard to substitute for. The M3, however, is left in a kind of no man's land. It doesn't have the firepower in relative terms to be part of the "main force", yet it's very size and bulk also means it is not a good support tank either.

Yes, the M3 can actually be worse off than the Type 89!

Of course, while the tournament's smallest size is ten tanks, they'll never be benched. But, suppose there's an event where the maximum is 6 or 7 tanks. How do they make sure they are not the 1-2 tanks left behind by Miho? That's what they are worried about. I'm sure that as a human, you can understand that while most of us eventually learn to accept we aren't the first, not even top third, we'll fight like hell to avoid being the last.

I'm also a bit dubious of the claim that Azusa would know how to call a retreat better than Leopon's captain. There is no in-series evidence for this. In fact, the main tank that Miho almost always used to make a defensive line is Leopon - in the series finale wherein they blocked Erika and co and twice in the this match, when they kept Pravda and co busy at different chokepoints. Rabbit team have not held a defensive line in the series as far as I know and Leopon has experience holding the line and have a tank better suited for it.

First, plugging the entrance and then firing at enemies until you die not a defense line experience make because it lacks the judgmental aspect.

Azusa doesn't have defense line experience. She does, however, have experience in keeping enemies occupied (which is the essential purpose of the OY defense line - that the defense line moves is not really a problem as long as it keeps them occupied as long as possible while keeping its assets intact). Half of the Anzio fight was about Azusa keeping two Semoventes off Miho by occupying them. Throughout the whole thing, she never succumbed to the pressure to make a hasty counterattack. And when the chance came, she popped them both, including a pursuit where she managed to move TWICE as fast as her opponent. And Miho felt comfortable with giving crap instructions like "Fight with them at a not-near, not-far distance."

The grasp of that mysterious "not-near, not-far" distance is basically what I said about the hit rate vs range curve. In that case, Azusa has to make sure to let the Semoventes feel like they have a chance all the time, lest they decide to break off. Yet she can't actually allow them to close enough that they do have a chance. You can't do that without knowing the market rates.

That kind of sense is something that Nakajima through no inherent fault of her own (she has the right temparament and I estimate she'll figure it out eventually) does not yet have. You'll notice she had help on the two decisions she did satisfactorily. The first time, a Type 97 volunteered itself into a fully open position and got blown away. This tells Nakajima they have near 100% Hit-Rate on full-open target now, so they should be approaching real danger for Half-Open Target. The 2nd time, you notice that Erwin actually gave a warning before Nakajima moved. The 3rd time, she tried to give the order but was too late and her own tank was clipped.

[tsunade666]

Lol, while rewatching the battles, I can't helped but feel nostalgic during the garden maze scene. It reminds me of battle tanks that I played before in family computer.

[Infinite Zenith]

Originally Posted by tsunade666

Lol, while rewatching the battles, I can't helped but feel nostalgic during the garden maze scene. It reminds me of battle tanks that I played before in family computer.

If you're referring to Battlezone, that was a totally amazing game. I played it on GameBoy Classic, loved getting the level four tank that could shoot through steel barriers, and it was fun to take out the really big tanks. Of course, I used to get the wits frightened out of me when the AI took out my base. I think the maze sections in the movie might've been a deliberate call-back to this game

[night_sentinel]

@arkhangelsk
While that is very informative specially about the bits regarding Azusa and the battle with Anzio. (Thank you for giving me another reason to watch the series again ) I think we're talking cross-purposes now. Let me try to make my objection clearer.

I do agree that Rabbit team could have been used much better so I'm not objecting to it. But, as I've said I believe its a mistake in hindsight and more than anything else a natural consequence of Miho's senshado.

Miho's senshado isn't really confusion-fu or unconventional tactics. Miho just used them a lot because the odds are always so terribly stacked against her that Miho cannot win ever if she goes by the book. I'm pretty sure if Miho finds by-the-book tactics appropriate for the situation, she'll use them. Instead, I'll propose that Miho's senshado at its very heart is treasuring her crew members - her friends. That's why Miho took up senshado again and continued to practice senshado, Everything else is secondary to that.

Its also the reason why Rabbit team or anyone on Miho's team should have no fear of ever being replaced because Miho's senshado at its core believe everyone of them to be no lesser than her and intrinsically important. Though, this does create its own pressure but I digress. You might be wondering what does that have to be anything?

I believe this is important because Miho's senshado color her tactical and strategic decision ever so slightly. Just like here in whether we should veto or not veto Rabbit team's initiative.

To move this discussion along, let us make two supposition using your argument.

Supposition 1: Azusa is better than Nakajima at holding the line at this particular scenario.
Supposition 2: Miho knows Azusa is better than Nakajima at holding the line at this particular scenario.

<These two supposition is very hard to prove since its asking to judge a hypothetical judgement at a hypothetical situation. While you did do it admirably, its still a guess if Azusa would perform better than Nakajima at this juncture. But, more importantly, even if supposition 1 is true we have no idea if Miho knows this.

So let's assume both are true for simplicity's sake. Basis for supposition 1 is your argument. And basis for supposition 2 is Miho's personality. >

Now, at this particular scenario. If Miho knows that is Azusa is better than Nakajima at holding the line would Miho veto Rabbits initiative, countercommand and ask them to fall back at Leopon's line?

I still firmly believe that Miho would still permit Rabbit to go after Nonna's tank. And the reason for this is because this is what Miho's senshado, her leadership is all about. See a corollary of thinking her crew members are valuable is well .... valuing their opinion and thinking their judgement is equal value to hers. This is also the reason why I believe that a tactic no matter how brain dead at its conception is still not discarded and used more appropriately. Miho gives a lot of weight to her crew members' opinion.

While some commander would automatically believe that they know better than their crew member. Miho does the opposite. For example I believe Miho thinks this questions . Does my tank commander see something in that situation that I can't see from my far vantage point? Does Azusa see a tactic that she can implement? Of course the danger of this is the fact that Miho can be overly permissive and trusting. But, to be fair, Miho does learn the quirk of those who follow her which is why her first command to Nishi in the university battle is to refrain from useless charging.

Now, on vetoing Rabbit's decision, the question became does Miho think Azusa has good judgement?

And as you've illustrated beautifully - past experience says that Azusa does. So when Azusa volunteers of her own initiative an action, Miho said yes because Miho trust Azusa to have good judgement on her tank situation perhaps even over her own.

Of course, we know in hindsight that it failed. But, the failure does not meant its an intrinsic flaw. Only it failed this time. After all, no philosophy or doctrine or senshado is perfect. And to be honest, this flaw/strength of Miho allowed Ooarai to have the most high initiative and creative crew bar none so it seemed to be working most of the time.

[Kazu-kun]

Originally Posted by night_sentinel

And to be honest, this flaw/strength of Miho allowed Ooarai to have the most high initiative and creative crew bar none so it seemed to be working most of the time.

This claim is a bit unfair if we take into account we are never shown other schools' entire crews. From most schools we only know a few key members.

[c933103]

4chan translated some drama cd of the movie

There're totally six tracks (which is the 3rd for the series) and are incredibly fun to listen to.

Notably more characterization come from that too.

[Julio C]

I avoided this forum for a while so I can watch the movie without knowing anything about it.

All I can say was, that it was GLORIOUS!

The whole movie was mostly non-stop action with a breather here and there. The main battle was just awesome and very long. It was so awesome to see the sisters team up to take out Alice. That was some elite team they fought, but Miho formed her own elite team as well.

This was the first time we actual see the Churchill tank get taken out.

I was hoping to see the Maus again to take out that super tank.

That artillery tank was a monster! I was surprised they allowed that, and even more surprised that no one was burn to a crisp.

The 5.1 track was demo worthy. It was loud and powerful. It feels like you were in the middle of the action. The sound effects were very clear and crisp. Vocals were clean too.

GuP has become one of my top 10 animes of all time now!

[night_sentinel]

Originally Posted by Kazu-kun

This claim is a bit unfair if we take into account we are never shown other schools' entire crews. From most schools we only know a few key members.

Just think of it as a hyperbole then.