AnimeSuki Forums

McW · 2016-10-15, 04:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kakurin-san

Don't quite get what you are saying there. Well, I was fairly happy seeing that both of them are divine. With maxed out God Slayer skill (+100%) and Primeval Rune (+50) I never got to see Ozymandias' NP. He was gone in a hurry.

Karna has anti-divine built-in on NP and AOE, you deal solid damage to all of them in one go. Just saying, not that really matters how it's cleared.

But I think Karna is better to fight Divine because you don't need skill CD, just like Euryale - Orion case.

quigonkenny · 2016-10-15, 04:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kakurin-san

Don't quite get what you are saying there. Well, I was fairly happy seeing that both of them are divine. With maxed out God Slayer skill (+100%) and Primeval Rune (+50) I never got to see Ozymandias' NP. He was gone in a hurry.

I think I used Jack for Ozy. I know I used Kintoki (Rider) to counter Nitocris, because I remember Ozy focusing fire on him. The whole thing was a pain in the ass...

Kakurin · 2016-10-15, 06:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by McW

But I think Karna is better to fight Divine because you don't need skill CD, just like Euryale - Orion case.

It really depends on what the situation is. Karna is dependent on the NP on the other hand. With Scathach I could set up a crit situation and wreck just about any divine servant without need of NP. +50% crit damage, +100% against divine and the Quick cards have +50%. When you get a crit, that's pretty gigantic right there. Moreover, comparing NPs it also depends on what your preference is. Taking out a single enemy in one shot or distributing the damage. With my Scathach at NP2 it's 1600% modified by +100% and +50% with the skills. Karna at NP2 has 562.5% against divine enemies.

Tactics · 2016-10-15, 06:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kakurin-san

It really depends on what the situation is. Karna is dependent on the NP on the other hand. With Scathach I could set up a crit situation and wreck just about any divine servant without need of NP. +50% crit damage, +100% against divine and the Quick cards have +50%. When you get a crit, that's pretty gigantic right there. Moreover, comparing NPs it also depends on what your preference is. Taking out a single enemy in one shot or distributing the damage. With my Scathach at NP2 it's 1600% modified by +100% and +50% with the skills. Karna at NP2 has 562.5% against divine enemies.

Its already a mistake to compare damage modifier between ST and AoE NP, moreover its between Quick and Buster NP.

Karna came up with NP Charge and NP Seal which IMO is good enough to compensate his lack of damage being AoE NP. Not counting his Bond CE. Shishou may won on damage, being ST NP, but if player roster can't afford good support for her (either NP Charge or star-generator for stable crits) or somehow geared into Buster support, Karna is better than her.

Kakurin · 2016-10-15, 06:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tactics

Its already a mistake to compare damage modifier between ST and AoE NP, moreover its between Quick and Buster NP.

Karna came up with NP Charge and NP Seal which IMO is good enough to compensate his lack of damage being AoE NP. Not counting his Bond CE. Shishou may won on damage, being ST NP, but if player roster can't afford good support for her (either NP Charge or star-generator for stable crits) or somehow geared into Buster support, Karna is better than her.

What did I say?

Quote:

Moreover, comparing NPs it also depends on what your preference is. Taking out a single enemy in one shot or distributing the damage.

MartianMage · 2016-10-15, 06:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by quigonkenny

Only problem now is finding consistent Halloween Petit Devil support. Even Lare doesn't have one. I've actually picked up a handful of new FL members after borrowing non-FL supports just because they had HPD. Worse comes to worst, I'll just miss out on some of the Berserker Pieces/Monuments. I've already got 50+ of each anyway...

It's not really a problem. You get enough pumpkin boosts from guerilla quests to buy out everything that matters. I mean look assuming you actually need to buy all pumpkin related items in the shop this is how it goes:

60 pumpkins for CEs
40 for lore
10 for eliz
60 for all pieces and monuments
170 total

If I remember correctly you are assured 60 or so pumpkins from guerilla rewards... this is not counting the potential pumpkin drops they drop at a decent rate. So you need 110 more pumpkins... each pumpkin drop is 3 pcs per stack so with non LB CE you get 4 per stack that means you need pumpkin to drop 28 times. Getting a pumpkin drop 28 times isn't really pushing it. And this is only true if you actually need to buy everything. For someone like me I only bought lore this time... so yeah

@Kakurin-san

While I agree that Scath is a better option in that fight I'd just like to say that Scath's anti-divine and quick up only lasts for 1 turn and considering that you fight Ozzy multiple times in that battle that means you are going to experience a considerable amount of downtime with Scath if you're facing multiple divine enemies. The same can be said to Karna really but I suppose Karna can actually build his NP fast and can delay NPs during his downtime. But seriously Karna needs his NP interlude =/

Kakurin · 2016-10-15, 06:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by MartianMage

While I agree that Scath is a better option in that fight I'd just like to say that Scath's anti-divine and quick up only lasts for 1 turn and considering that you fight Ozzy multiple times in that battle that means you are going to experience a considerable amount of downtime with Scath if you're facing multiple divine enemies. The same can be said to Karna really but I suppose Karna can actually build his NP fast and can delay NPs during his downtime. But seriously Karna needs his NP interlude =/

It depends on your setup. When you can supply Scathach with a steady amount of crit stars (I have 2030) it's no problem to build her NP in a hurry.

MartianMage · 2016-10-15, 06:50

True but the same setup works for Karna too anyway and might be even easier for him since his crit damage component(that always activate =x) is on a skill meant to be spammed.

Kakurin · 2016-10-15, 07:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by MartianMage

True but the same setup works for Karna too anyway and might be even easier for him since his crit damage component(that always activate =x) is on a skill meant to be spammed.

His skill may be meant to be spammed, but the cooldown is a turn longer than Scathach's. Moreover it does increase star generation but not star absorption. The downside to Scathach's skill is that it's an 80% chance and not guaranteed.

LowCholesterol · 2016-10-15, 07:29

Karna-Stheno-Zhuge might be an unique combination

larethian · 2016-10-15, 07:58

Scathach is better vs boss or raid boss simply by virtue of a sure stun. No one except Scathach has a stun that cannot be resisted with MR, which makes her very unique and a top tier servant. She also has a dodge. And the trait multipliers stack for big numbers on her. You do not need to spam NP or worry about rebuilding NP when you can make a one-shot setup.

MartianMage · 2016-10-15, 08:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by larethian

Scathach is better vs boss or raid boss simply by virtue of a sure stun. No one except Scathach has a stun that cannot be resisted with MR, which makes her very unique and a top tier servant. She also has a dodge. And the trait multipliers stack for big numbers on her. You do not need to spam NP or worry about rebuilding NP when you can make a one-shot setup.

huh? Are you sure the stun can't be resisted? Cause I'm pretty sure I've seen it resisted before...

LowCholesterol · 2016-10-15, 08:29

yeah, it could miss. i've experienced it myself

Kakurin · 2016-10-15, 09:02

No it can't miss. It only "misses" if the target is already in a stunned state.

hinode · 2016-10-15, 09:18

IIRC Tamalancer's charm skill bypasses MR since it has a demerit attached to it, but I don't have enough experience using it to be entirely sure.

larethian · 2016-10-15, 09:54

Tamalancer's charm skill has no demerit to it. And demerit is not a reason for MR bypassing. Her charm bypasses MR because it has no hit rate % in the datamine. This value is needed for debuff success calculation vs MR. Scathach's stun has no value as well and it has been determined by Kyte since her release that her stun cannot be resisted.

The only way I think it can be 'resisted' is when there's a debuff immunity like Sanzou or Ruler Martha's skill (T-shirt icon) which ignores checking MR as well. In one of my first runs against Medb last event, my Phantom ignored her sure charm when he had a T-shirt on him. Scathach's stun bypassing MR should be a well known fact. It's the reason why I was determined to roll for her after Ibaraki event.

And previously 'miss' and 'no effect' were lumped together. If enemy is already stunned such as from Waver's NP, it will of course miss (now should get the 'no effect' message instead).

GDB · 2016-10-15, 09:56

Giving the opponent an NP charge is a demerit. That said, while it's "100%", it can still be resisted.

Also, ones without value do actually have a value. It's 500%.

larethian · 2016-10-15, 10:05

Checks back yeah she does give an np charge.

Ryoshi · 2016-10-15, 10:12

Alright, so finally bought out the shop bar pieces and monuments. Still no CE drops in missions so I'm still plugging away at LB'ing the Halloween CEs.

Seeing as I've got 700K FPs, decided to do some FP rolls to sell for QP. Ended up pulling a second Angry Manju

Surprised that they still threw us with the "New Servant" animation despite him being NP2.. guess the boys a bit special, eh? The game even auto-locked him upon summoning.

Also surprised that I managed to pull the Halloween 3 star CE in the FP draw as well.

Sheba · 2016-10-15, 10:16

Well, even when you push to skip the animation, it WILL still play when you pull a SR or a SSR Servant.

And Scathach is the last of those released that is on my wishlist, other than Ruler Martha. I am not in a hurry for those like Artoria or Gil.

2016-10-15, 06:50	Link #18748
MartianMage Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2006	True but the same setup works for Karna too anyway and might be even easier for him since his crit damage component(that always activate =x) is on a skill meant to be spammed. __________________ Homura: Die monster! You don't belong in this world! Kyubey: It was not by my hand that I am once again given flesh. I was called here by humans who wish to pay me tribute. Homura: Tribute? You steal girls' souls, and make them your slaves! Kyubey: Perhaps the same could be said of all religions. Homura: Your words are as empty as your soul! Lolis ill-needs a savior such as you! Kyubey: What is a loli? A miserable little pile of moe! But enough talk...have at you!

2016-10-15, 07:29	Link #18750
LowCholesterol Teacher : The Awakening Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Where am I? Age: 29	Karna-Stheno-Zhuge might be an unique combination __________________ FGO ID : 261,201,342. IGN: Manfred FGO wishlist : i didn't wish anything but a better gacha rate & luck

2016-10-15, 08:29	Link #18753
LowCholesterol Teacher : The Awakening Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Where am I? Age: 29	yeah, it could miss. i've experienced it myself __________________ FGO ID : 261,201,342. IGN: Manfred FGO wishlist : i didn't wish anything but a better gacha rate & luck

2016-10-15, 09:02	Link #18754
Kakurin 大佐 Join Date: Jun 2013	No it can't miss. It only "misses" if the target is already in a stunned state. __________________

2016-10-15, 07:58	Link #18751
larethian Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010	Scathach is better vs boss or raid boss simply by virtue of a sure stun. No one except Scathach has a stun that cannot be resisted with MR, which makes her very unique and a top tier servant. She also has a dodge. And the trait multipliers stack for big numbers on her. You do not need to spam NP or worry about rebuilding NP when you can make a one-shot setup.

2016-10-15, 09:18	Link #18755
hinode Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007	IIRC Tamalancer's charm skill bypasses MR since it has a demerit attached to it, but I don't have enough experience using it to be entirely sure.

2016-10-15, 09:54	Link #18756
larethian Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010	Tamalancer's charm skill has no demerit to it. And demerit is not a reason for MR bypassing. Her charm bypasses MR because it has no hit rate % in the datamine. This value is needed for debuff success calculation vs MR. Scathach's stun has no value as well and it has been determined by Kyte since her release that her stun cannot be resisted. The only way I think it can be 'resisted' is when there's a debuff immunity like Sanzou or Ruler Martha's skill (T-shirt icon) which ignores checking MR as well. In one of my first runs against Medb last event, my Phantom ignored her sure charm when he had a T-shirt on him. Scathach's stun bypassing MR should be a well known fact. It's the reason why I was determined to roll for her after Ibaraki event. And previously 'miss' and 'no effect' were lumped together. If enemy is already stunned such as from Waver's NP, it will of course miss (now should get the 'no effect' message instead).

2016-10-15, 09:56	Link #18757
GDB Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2008 Age: 38	Giving the opponent an NP charge is a demerit. That said, while it's "100%", it can still be resisted. Also, ones without value do actually have a value. It's 500%.

2016-10-15, 10:05	Link #18758
larethian Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2010	Checks back yeah she does give an np charge.

2016-10-15, 10:12	Link #18759
Ryoshi Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2014	Alright, so finally bought out the shop bar pieces and monuments. Still no CE drops in missions so I'm still plugging away at LB'ing the Halloween CEs. Seeing as I've got 700K FPs, decided to do some FP rolls to sell for QP. Ended up pulling a second Angry Manju Surprised that they still threw us with the "New Servant" animation despite him being NP2.. guess the boys a bit special, eh? The game even auto-locked him upon summoning. Also surprised that I managed to pull the Halloween 3 star CE in the FP draw as well.

2016-10-15, 10:16	Link #18760
Sheba RUN, YOU FOOLS! Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Formerly Iwakawa base and Chaldea. Now Teyvat, the Astral Express & the Outpost Age: 44	Well, even when you push to skip the animation, it WILL still play when you pull a SR or a SSR Servant. And Scathach is the last of those released that is on my wishlist, other than Ruler Martha. I am not in a hurry for those like Artoria or Gil.