High School DxD Light Novel - Volume 21

[Hakai]

I don't think just being above Maou Class is enough to be a Super Devil

I heard from Sensei that there are three Devils who are called in such way in the past. Because they had abilities that are too much beyond the other Devils. They are irregular existences which make people question whether they are even Devils

That kind of portrayal is considerably above Maou Class
There are several Maou Class devils

But yeah, Azi was already said to be 'equal' to Crom
So maybe i shouldn't be that surprised

[Seafoam]

Originally Posted by Cake-Carrot

I don't think just being above Maou Class is enough to be a Super Devil



That kind of portrayal is considerably above Maou Class
There are several Maou Class devils

But yeah, Azi was already said to be 'equal' to Crom
So maybe i shouldn't be that surprised

I thought that at first but look at how easily Rizevim got curbstomped by Issei. He even wondered how Rizevim was considered one. I kinda feel like Ishibumi retconned his strength and nerfed him a bit though

[XFire]

Originally Posted by Going Seafoam

I thought that at first but look at how easily Rizevim got curbstomped by Issei. He even wondered how Rizevim was considered one. I kinda feel like Ishibumi retconned his strength and nerfed him a bit though

Rizeviem was physically and mentally exhausted from being butchered thousands of times over by Fafnir, and still held the line against Issei (who if you believe the hype was literally infinitely strong at that point) for a while.

[Hakai]

I'd take Azazel and the underworld's opinion over Ise on that one

He tends to unreasonably downplay and shit talk his opponents at the last moment(the shit talking part is justified), did the same shit to Euclid

Heck, did he even see Sirzechs in his true form?
He shouldn't have any idea on what level a Super Devil should be unless he's seen Sirzechs or Ajuka getting serious

Also could be that he didn't realize his own strength in that form
It was powered by Ophis and made the Sekiryuutei's ability 'limitless' according Ddraig so Rizevim was bound to get stomped

[Chris38]

Personally I doubt that Ise is going to be capable of using DxD mode so soon after his last use.

Since, just like Longinus Smasher I believe that it's going to have some pretty heavy usage restrictions ... at least until Ise manages to adapt to it's power - which is ... obviously not going to happen so quickly considering the previous pattern regarding Ise's power ups.

[Chichiryuushintei]

There's a gigantic gap between Maou-Level and Top 10 material. I'm pretty sure that was stated pretty early on, in v4 IIRC. Riz was just in-between, but still probably was stronger than most Gods.

Let's not forget he dismised an all-out, rage-fueled attack from Michael, which by default, was supposed to be Super Effective on him, without much trouble.

[Hakai]

You can forget about V4

Sirzechs a Top 10 is stated to be ten times stronger than the original Lucifer
Who obviously is a maou class

And that was on the quantity of aura alone, unless Lucifer had any hax better than POD the gap would be even bigger than ten times

I mean the guy is made out of POD/Demonic powers
That alone is ridiculous even without considering the 10x Lucifer aura

[DragonOsman]

@Cake: Unless Ise starts to really spam DxD mode unreasonably, I don't really mind. If he really ends up needing it against Apophis, it's at least understandable. But an upgrade to the Cardinal Crimson Queen does sound good. As long as it isn't a major power-up, I can see it happening, too, since Ishi said DxD mode would be Ise's final big power-up.

What we really need is for Cardinal Crimson Queen to get as powerful as Ddraig before he was sealed. Ise needs to stabilize and master it for that. What upgrades do you think Ishi might give to the mode aside from that?

As for Apophis and Azi-Dahaka being more powerful than Rizevim, I have to say it's not that surprising considering the fact that they're supposed to be legendary Evil Dragons who are a lot more powerful (and also matter much more) than Nidhogg. I don't know about Super Devils only being a class of Devils more powerful than Maou, but I do think they're supposed to be abnormally powerful Devils at least. But that being said, Rizevim was the weakest, so the main question is if these two Evil Dragons are also stronger than Sirzechs and Ajuka, since they're both much more powerful than Rizevim was and are the strongest Super Devils.

Edit: I didn't see this page at all before I posted. Ah, well.

Anyway, Cake is right about Sirzechs' power compared to the original Lucifer IMO.

But yeah, I do think Ise might not fully understand yet how much stronger he was compared to Rizevim in DxD mode, and I also doubt he knows yet how terrifyingly powerful Sirzechs is in his true form.

[Hakai]

The upgrade to CCQ doesn't have to be anything new or complicated
It could just be simple increase in stats
Remember what Azazel said? ''That guy's Sacred Gear's power must have increased tremendously'' for the happiness of being accepted by his parents

And DxD is not going to be his last major power up *cough*Ex spoilers *cough*
Maybe it'll be the last one we'll get to see in the main time line, by the time the story ends

I wouldn't be willing to even consider putting anyone other than 5-6 people above Sirzechs or Ajuka until they show the feats.
These two evil Dragons are weaker than Crom that's for sure.

Ajuka on the other hand was crushing several Ultimate Class devils by redirecting and modifying their own attacks, all while sitting on a chair..that's the definition of overpowered

[DragonOsman]

He can change the formula and power of an attack when he modifies, it, too, though, but yeah, I definitely agree about it being too overly powerful (saying "overpowered" reminds me of how they say someone was overpowered by someone else - which really means something completely different from what we intend when we say that something or someone is OP, no?).

Yeah, I do remember what Azazel said, yes. So yeah, some sort of upgrade has to me coming, at least.

I do want to know how strong Apophis and Azi-Dahaka actually are. But by Shounen rules, it makes sense that since they're the next bad guys the heroes fight after Rizevim, they'd be stronger. Major baddies in Shounen are generally progressively stronger.

[Hakai]

Originally Posted by DragonOsman

He can change the formula and power of an attack when he modifies, it, too, though, but yeah, I definitely agree about it being too overly powerful (saying "overpowered" reminds me of how they say someone was overpowered by someone else - which really means something completely different from what we intend when we say that something or someone is OP, no?).

Yeah, I do remember what Azazel said, yes. So yeah, some sort of upgrade has to me coming, at least.

I do want to know how strong Apophis and Azi-Dahaka actually are. But by Shounen rules, it makes sense that since they're the next bad guys the heroes fight after Rizevim, they'd be stronger. Major baddies in Shounen are generally progressively stronger.

Actually OP = Overpowered, at least that's how we've been saying for a while, you can Google it for further clarification

Here's my thoughts on Azi's power

Originally Posted by V17

The three-headed Dragon. ……I can tell he has a dense and evil aura even from this vision. ……I heard that he is called equal to that Crom Cruach, right

Now which Crom is he equal with?
The one that trained and became Heavenly Dragon class or the one from before who was still considered the strongest evil dragon?

I'd say it's the latter because not many people should know about Crom's training and him being Heavenly Dragon class was just Ddraig's speculation

So he's probably around pre-training Crom level, maybe a bit higher through Holy Grail
But we'll really know in the next volume, Ishi put him in a pretty important position so his strength might be retconned

[coded321]

that summary gives me final volume vibes

[Chichiryuushintei]

It was already confirmed by Ishi there'll be another arc.

[DragonOsman]

@Cake (about OP): Be that as it may, the dictionary definition is the dictionary definition and that one will tell you otherwise. When we say that something is OP, dictionary-wise it should mean "overly powerful". To overpower someone or something means something entirely different ("to overcome, master, or subdue by superior force" - dictionary.reference.com, first definition out of the four listed).

Anyways, yeah, you're probably right about Azi-Dahaka being as powerful as Crom Cruach before his training. We'll see, though. A confirmation of how strong Azi-Dahaka and Apophis really are would be great.

@Chichi (about another arc being confirmed): Yep. It's true.

[beast 666]

from my point of visit Azi Dahaka and Apophis, showed that they are cowards because they have not been able to fight without having someone more powerful by his side always with Rizevim and now Thihexa right?, since perhaps more powerful than issei in Cardinal Carmesi mode, but if really they were that always be in the shadow of one more powerful that the? , and Apophis comment "no can beat me with your cardinal Camersi", this I dislike, since if issei again uses the DXD mode it is clear that this time will die, so I hope of Vali look amazing in this v21 and see something more than vali and his power

[Chichiryuushintei]

I wouldn't say they are cowards. They are just really, really shallow characters. The closest resemblance to something unique to them is Azi's 3 personalities. And even then, that's just a quirk.

[DragonOsman]

Yeah. Also, I really doubt Ise will die just from using DxD mode. I'm sure he can handle it. Plus, that line Apophis really makes me want to read the Ise vs. Apophis fight.

[Tbolt]

Don't forget about Crom's banana power up, don't look down on the power of the banana.

[Rieyay]

We are ―― me and Issei, together forever.

So, Issei.

Do not cry――.

―Infinite Dragon Ophis

Does this imply Ophis dies and she will remain with Issei because he has "her/her power" in him ;_;
ISHI JUST DONT DO ITTTTT

[DragonOsman]

Are you saying Ise can get stronger from a banana because he's a Dragon? Well, then it goes double for him, sort of, since bananas are also good for humans (it's just that they don't make us stronger, per say).

Edit: One post late.
@Rieyay: I'm pretty sure Ophis isn't dying. We've had plenty of death-flags, and yet none of the good guys have died yet (thankfully). But something might still happen, short of her actually dying, so just brace yourself.