Hong Kong Current Events

[Cloudedmind]

Originally Posted by Yu Ominae

AP has this article on the blowback the NBA is facing:

Wow, so the Lakers had a bad week in China because as usual the Chinese government overreacted to a perceived slight. That is so sad to hear. Yes, perhaps next time Morey really should educate himself better before showing support for the millions of Hong Kong residents who've had to deal with Chinese governance for over 2 decades, and who've been having a hellish last several months, as many of them fight for what they see as their human rights.

I mean god forbid profits for the NBA dip so low that they can't even bare to pay their thousands of employees. Perhaps I'm uninformed, but did China suddenly become the NBA's sole means of financial gain? Has the NBA really hit such a low slump? Perhaps they should start taking up donations, I'm pretty sure I have a few dollars lying around. But, thank you sooo much King James for educating all of us on the utter damage our words can have on the NBA when showing support for people fighting for their rights.

I would hate for anyone to lose their job because some misinformed person supports this little thing called human rights. I do hope he has this same concern the next time one of our unarmed black brothers or sisters is gunned down by police, and people start to show support for that. I'd hate to hurt the polices feelings, and have them start to boycott the NBA. I mean apparently the NBA is already in such dire straights, that that could be a mighty blow. So, lets all hold our hands in solidarity with the NBA and hope they're able to bounce back from such a tragedy. And lets all remember stick and stones may break your bones, but, words...words can launch a billion dollar enterprise into the shitter. So tragic.

Be careful or you may also have your soul sucked out by China, and the almighty yuan.

*washes my hands of this bullshit*

[Kakurin]

Originally Posted by Eisdrache

~70 years of peaceful protest have worked great for North Korea.

I must have missed the millions demonstrating in North Korea for 70 years... Your comparison of North Korea to Hong Kong is as appropriate as comparing the recent attack on a synagogue in the German city of Halle to the Holocaust.

With all due respect to Gandhi's accomplishments, it would not achieve anything of substance in today's China.

Again, I must have missed the mass protests going on in mainland China.

A non-violent approach is indeed preferable but how long is one willing to suffer the abuse? Ten years? Thirty years? Fifty? Especially in the face of China's control growing stronger as time goes on. Let's face it, China is absolutely willing to use violence anywhere, anytime, and they are the far stronger player. A non-violent process from their side is just a delusional pipe dream. You can see how far this delusion has spread when people in this very thread are believing with heart and soul that the police in Hong Kong is just peacefully defending themselves. Today's parents are going to be so happy to tell their children that they can look forward to another generation of oppression so that maybe their grand-children can live free.

I got it. So you are of the type of person that happily sacrifice the actual lives and livelihoods of thousands and millions of people just to fill the ego of hundreds as long as those hundreds claim to spread their violence for "the right thing"... But tell me, when was the last time rioting and terrorism actually caused fundamental change?

[Eisdrache]

Originally Posted by Kakurin

I must have missed the millions demonstrating in North Korea for 70 years... Your comparison of North Korea to Hong Kong is as appropriate as comparing the recent attack on a synagogue in the German city of Halle to the Holocaust.

They have had "peace" if you can call this farce like that from Kim Il Sung through Kim Jong Il and now Kim Jong Un. Think about what that means. North Koreans have been living a miserable life for three generations now. Un isn't going away because of some peaceful protest. It is impossible to say what effect a violent uprising would have caused in the earlier stages of the Kim dynasty but we can be quite certain that whatever was tried so far did not work.

Originally Posted by Kakurin

Again, I must have missed the mass protests going on in mainland China.

Well of course, Gandhi didn't live in China after all. His form of protest caught on because it fell on fertile ground during a time when he benefited further from several circumstances. This does not take anything away from what he did but unfortunately that time has passed long ago and certainly does not exist in today's China.

Originally Posted by Kakurin

I got it. So you are of the type of person that happily sacrifice the actual lives and livelihoods of thousands and millions of people just to fill the ego of hundreds as long as those hundreds claim to spread their violence for "the right thing"... But tell me, when was the last time rioting and terrorism actually caused fundamental change?

You are misunderstanding something and deliberately so. A bummer really. I never said to use violence as a first step. Or a second. Or a third. Violence should always be a last solution when everything else has failed. When has everything else failed? I don't know. I admire your dedication to find a peaceful solution but how often are you they willing to fall short? China will try again next year, then the year after that and so on. Even if this bill has failed in Hong Kong for the time being this is just a mere band-aid. A valuable band-aid but a band-aid nonetheless. Until the actual problem in China is not solved they will just keep trying until they succeed - and they will succeed given enough time.

[Yu Ominae]

Looks new:

SHANGHAI/HONG KONG (Reuters) - China has banned the bulk shipment to Hong Kong of black clothing and other gear used by pro-democracy protesters, staff at Chinese courier firms said, amid four months of often violent unrest in the city.

Customer services staff at some of China's major couriers, including STO Express, ZTO Express and YTO Express, told Reuters that the curbs were put in place around August.

One staff member from STO said that single pieces of black clothing could be sent to Chinese-ruled Hong Kong, but shipments of more than five pieces would be stopped. They were also not allowed to ship masks, bulk orders of umbrellas or sticks.

"Any items that can be used by mobs," he said.

A Hong Kong-based customer service employee at S.F. Holding's S.F. Express said it had not been informed of the new measures.

China's courier network is made up of thousands of firms of which ZTO, YTO, STO, Yunda Holding and S.F. Express are among the biggest players. ZTO and YTO declined to comment, while STO said that it abided by China's laws and regulations.

SF Express, Yunda Holding and China's General Administration of Customs, which manages the country's imports and exports of goods, did not immediately respond to requests for comment.

Black clothing and now-banned masks have been regularly worn by protesters in Hong Kong who have thrown petrol bombs at police, set street fires, trashed metro stations and public buildings and stormed the legislature. Police have responded with tear gas, rubber bullets, water canon and several live rounds.

The protesters are angry at what they see as Beijing's tightening grip on Hong Kong, which was guaranteed 50 years of freedoms not extended to the mainland under a "one country, two systems" formula when Britain returned the city to China in 1997.

Beijing rejects the charge and accuses Western countries, especially the United States and Britain, of stirring up trouble. The unrest poses the biggest popular challenge to Chinese President Xi Jinping who has warned that any attempt to divide China will be crushed.

The shipping restrictions appear to be having little impact on the ground in Hong Kong, however, sales representatives at retailers such as Uniqlo, H&M and Giordano Ladies told Reuters.

Most said they had not heard of a ban on black clothing, and all said they had not received any corporate directives related to the ban, but also that they had not noticed an increase in the sale of black clothing.

One H&M manager, dressed in black, said she was surprised to hear of such restrictions. "We can sell black clothing," she said. "We can also wear it."

[Toukairin]

That is beyond fucking retarded by the HKPF.

YouTube

https://youtu.be/-iu5V18UeFU

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First of all, the people in that mosque did nothing but do the usual Sunday prayer. Then the cops bring the water cannon truck to spew their blue shit on the steps outside mosque before they force civilians to clean up the mess. Retarded, fucked up, and totally gratuitous, I'm lacking adjectives to describe this shit.

[Yu Ominae]

Damage control is already done. Lam visited the imams and Muslim community reps to apologize for the water cannon hitting the mosque gate.

[OH&S]

^
By water cannon, you mean blue dye mixed with pepper-spray-like irritants, right?

Also, the majority of people hit in the video above were not even protestors but journalists and bystanders.

And while its not directly connected, please remember that the Chinese government is currently carrying out an ethnic cleansing/genocide of the Uygher Muslims.

The cruelty of the Chinese Government knows no bounds and I greatly fear for what will happen to the protestors in Hong Kong if international attention on their situation wanes. But so far, the Streisand Effect appears to be working to the favor of the protestors.

[Yu Ominae]

Official now...

From NHK.

Hong Kong's government has formally withdrawn a controversial extradition bill that sparked months of mass protests.

The Legislative Council completed the process on Wednesday afternoon.

The bill was supposed to have been scrapped last week, but it was delayed after pro-democracy lawmakers disrupted the proceedings.

The bill would have allowed suspects to be sent to mainland China for trial. It triggered huge protests in June, with many Hong Kongers saying it was a sign of Beijing's growing influence in the region.

As the unrest intensified, Hong Kong's chief executive Carrie Lam said last month the bill would be withdrawn when the legislature reconvened.

The announcement was widely seen as an attempt to address the protesters' demands. But they're now calling for Lam to step down. They also want democratic reforms, and an investigation into whether police have used excessive force.

Legislators are also set to discuss a regulation banning face masks at the protests. The measure drew intense criticism, and was introduced under a Hong Kong emergency law earlier this month. It was the first time that legislation had been used in more than 50 years.

[Toukairin]

Hong Kong protests: Two people in critical condition after day of chaos (BBC)

There is a reason why you do NOT carry firearms ever in a zone where protests take place; I don't think I can say it enough times at all. Even Russian cops, who are about part of the most repressive police force in the world when it comes to protecting a regime, are not that stupid to carry firearms anywhere near protests. Besides, where is the trigger discipline here? This whole clusterfuck is all down to stupidity, cruelty, and misgovernment transpiring from the very top of the government to the lowest meatheaded shitsack wearing the uniform.

The last time someone have talked about cruelty, stupidity, and misgovernment in a same sentence, it was former UK Prime Minister William E. Gladstone who said about the situation in Ireland. His words were prophetic since Britain ended up losing Ireland less than 25 years after his death.

Originally Posted by William E. Gladstone

We are bound to lose Ireland in consequence of years of cruelty, stupidity and misgovernment, and I would rather lose her as a friend than as a foe.

If the Chinese think they can submit anybody to their will through force, they better think again because the British failed exactly that with Ireland in the aftermath of the 1916 Easter Rising. It only increased popular support for independence. History is full of patterns overlapping across countries, across regions, and across people.

China should better start thinking how they want to lose Hong Kong - as a friend or as a foe.

[SeijiSensei]

Originally Posted by Toukairin

There is a reason why you do NOT carry firearms ever in a zone where protests take place; I don't think I can say it enough times at all. Even Russian cops, who are about part of the most repressive police force in the world when it comes to protecting a regime, are not that stupid to carry firearms anywhere near protests.

Every protest I attended during the Vietnam War era involved police with firearms. Here are the Chicago Police during the demonstrations at the 1968 Democratic National Convention.



Then we had the Ohio National Guard on the campus of Kent State in 1970. They shot four students to death.



In case you think things have changed in America, here are the police arrayed against the demonstrators in Ferguson, Missouri. The police in this relatively small suburb of St. Louis not only carried firearms but used armored vehicles from the national program that distributes military hardware to local police forces.



And just this past week, Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) deployed this vehicle in Queens, New York. It's still not obvious why they needed an armored vehicle to enforce immigration laws.

[Toukairin]

What happened in the 1970s was a travesty, one more reason why the US have avoided bringing weapons with live ammunition near protests for a long time. But in Ferguson, that show of force was declared by the DOJ to be a misconduct against the citizenry of Ferguson by among other things discriminating against African Americans and applying racial stereotypes, in a "pattern or practice of unlawful conduct."

I saw student protests going really sour in Montreal a few years ago, with strong clashes against LEOs. However, carrying firearms near protests has always been a no-no. In London, SFOs (special firearms officers) are only deployed when there is a terrorist threat like the attack on London Bridge or the 2017 Manchester bombing, but never anywhere near protests. For the topic at hand here, what the hell are cops do in a city/country, where gun ownership and genuine terrorist threats are closer to non-existent compared to most places in the Western world, doing by carrying guns around?

Originally Posted by SeijiSensei

And just this past week, Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) deployed this vehicle in Queens, New York. It's still not obvious why they needed an armored vehicle to enforce immigration laws.

That recent incident in Queens is disgusting in itself. Gratuitous and reckless. The worst thing is that, unlike in the aftermath of Ferguson, this DOJ will not condemn those ICE agents for showing off their hardware.

[Anh_Minh]

Last year some cops here in France had to draw their weapons (they didn't fire) when protesters advanced on them.

[TheForsaken]

Originally Posted by Toukairin

Hong Kong protests: Two people in critical condition after day of chaos (BBC)
There is a reason why you do NOT carry firearms ever in a zone where protests take place; I don't think I can say it enough times at all. Even Russian cops, who are about part of the most repressive police force in the world when it comes to protecting a regime, are not that stupid to carry firearms anywhere near protests. Besides, where is the trigger discipline here? This whole clusterfuck is all down to stupidity, cruelty, and misgovernment transpiring from the very top of the government to the lowest meatheaded shitsack wearing the uniform.

How about having the common sense of not advancing toward a cop who is pointing a gun at you and trying to grab his weapon?

By the way, why do you focus on the rioter who got shot due to his own reckless action, instead of a civilian who was literally burned alive by the rioters?

[Toukairin]

Originally Posted by TheForsaken

How about having the common sense of not advancing toward a cop who is pointing a gun at you and trying to grab his weapon?

By the way, why do you focus on the rioter who got shot due to his own reckless action, instead of a civilian who was literally burned alive by the rioters?

Is the cop paid to defuse a situation or to act like a c***? And how do you explain for the student who died after "falling off" from a building where police were raiding days ago. Answer those questions first if you accept the challenge, but I already know what you will answer.

For the record, police officers are fucking things and harming people around with the government's OK not only in Hong Kong. Their counterparts in Chile, Catalonia, Vietnam, Haiti, and Iraq these days are dong the same; they are the ones who should be thrown in jail.

Last but not least, your "poor civilian" acted like a c*** by teasing people openly in a very tense context according to all accounts. You talk about one guy not having common sense, but I don't see how the other guy had any more common sense. It's very unfortunate to him, but that is the direct result of misgovernment and arrogance from those in power and their enablers. You sow the wind, you will reap the storm.

[TheForsaken]

Originally Posted by Toukairin

Is the cop paid to defuse a situation or to act like a c***?

Cops are paid to arrest criminals, and shoot them if necessary.
If you are trying to grab a cop's gun, you deserve to be shot.

Originally Posted by Toukairin

Last but not least, your "poor civilian" acted like a c*** by teasing people openly in a very tense context according to all accounts. You talk about one guy not having common sense, but I don't see how the other guy had any more common sense. It's very unfortunate to him, but that is the direct result of misgovernment and arrogance from those in power and their enablers. You sow the wind, you will reap the storm.

Are you seriously defending the pieces of shit who burn someone alive just because he disagrees with them ???

YouTube

https://youtu.be/faO3o0T84Qs

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

Look at the footage!
Yeah, obviously the victim's fault

[OH&S]

In other news, here's HK Police attacking a pregnant women for no good reason.

[Cosmic Eagle]

I hope the baby's alright....

[TheForsaken]

It looks like Youtube is doing their best to delete every video of the man being burned alive by the rioters.

Oh well, what else should I expect from the West's propaganda machine?

[Key Board]

Hongkong looked at China, and saw what it has done to the Uyghurs and political dissidents.
You can preach about unity and one China all you want, but that has never been the case.

Especially since this "we are all one nation" propaganda has been historically used to ignore huge systematic problems.
In fact, it happening in the United States too.

//

[Eisdrache]

Originally Posted by Toukairin

There is a reason why you do NOT carry firearms ever in a zone where protests take place;

Originally Posted by TheForsaken

Are you seriously defending the pieces of shit who burn someone alive just because he disagrees with them ???

It's sad how you guys just play merry-go-round with accusing the other of excessive violence. Welcome to reality where both violent protesters and violent police have set the bar higher with each retaliation and counter-retaliation. Immolating someone is just as unacceptable as shooting a protester. As if it matters who was worse than the other.

I did argue about this with Kakurin on the previous page but violence is nothing else than a last-ditch outlet to break the status quo when everything else has failed. It is NOT a solution and will never be one. As long as you guys refuse to acknowledge that basic fact you might as well get out of this thread.

Originally Posted by Toukairin

China should better start thinking how they want to lose Hong Kong - as a friend or as a foe.

You're delusional to think that Hong Kong has the option to part with China.