Mahouka - Episode 9 Discussion / Poll

[thundrakkon]

Originally Posted by SigUp

You can likewise turn it around and ask is Ushiyama only being overly humble? Tatsuya did state that Ushiyama is the head of that facility. A part from that reaction by Ushiyama may very well be because Tatsuya is a part of the Yotsuba family and so to speak employs them (which may be a very interesting contrast to the reception by members of the Yotsuba family itself who see him only as a bodyguard). Tatsuya also stated that without the technical assistance by Ushiyama the loop casting system couldn't have been realised. From the little bits we have gotten until now I'd say the look is more like of Tatsuya being the theoretician and Ushiyama being the guy who turns the theory into reality. If I borrow an analogy it's kind of like in physics where you have a group that comes up with new theories using mathematical models as a foundation, while the other group then thinks of a way to prove that theory in practice. Whether the relationship is 50/50, 60/40, 70/30 etc. is open to interpretation, but there is a need from Tatsuya's side for Ushiyama. He can't realise his plans without Ushiyama and that's all it counts.

Well, that could be true. I'm going off what I've seen from this episode and previous ones. Then again, Ushiyama has a whole team of engineers helping him out. If Tatsuya is giving them the theories, then he is essentially giving them a sort of blueprint to work off of. It is the engineers' job to fine tune and troubleshoot. As head of the department, he must be talented as well. I'm just not sure how talented is all.

@karice67

Thanks for trying to steer the thread in a more productive direction. Btw, like always, I'm an anime-only viewer. I just pick up on details very easily, so I do get really annoyed at spoilers and hints. Also, there was one point I didn't add in the original post, but a later one.

Originally Posted by thundrakkon

I forgot to add that Miyuki is supposedly the leading candidate to succeed the Yotsuba family, which means there are a few other possible candidates as well. Will we ever get to meet them? Who knows... However, I'm guessing that they are quite powerful as well, to be considered as candidates to succeed the Yotsuba.

[karice67]

^
Yeah, I was pretty certain you're an anime-only viewer - it's just that your tl;dr post was the first example of constructive observation and question raising that came to mind and that's something I think LN readers should be able to pretend to be doing if they suppressed their inclinations to fall back on the 'this is what the LN revealed here' card...

(And thanks for the appreciation - I can only hope it helps a little!)

[Kakurin]

Originally Posted by Anh_Minh

out of what I think are standard parts. (The T-7 models that they apparently keep in stock.)

Yeah, exactly ten of them. And going by Ushiyama's reaction this device was specifically designed for the purpose of a flying device. He immediately recognised it as such. Besides, Tatsuya stated he programmed that into the "mock-up" Ushiyama made, indicating that it isn't a standard part.

Originally Posted by thundrakkon

If Tatsuya is giving them the theories, then he is essentially giving them a sort of blueprint to work off of.

That is in need of clarification. We can't say for sure in either direction. For sure Tatsuya gave him an idea of what he needed. But it also may very well be possible that Tatsuya only gave him something like "I need a thing that's this size and can do this" while the entire design is all Ushiyama.

[Faerie]

Spoiler for Tl;dr: show needs to focus more on the actual plot :):

I'm going to point this out, since a lot of people seem to be offended that some viewers allegedly keep going on and on about "the same things" and ignore the "important parts"... Could this be because these things not just get repeated ad nauseam in every episode but actually make up the lion share of it?
Take episode 9. It was maybe 5 minutes (a bit more if you're generous) of actual plot and the rest of the episode was there to glorify Tatsuya in various ways, make us feel artificially bad for him and to show various shots of Miyuki repetitively (and some side characters also) creaming herself over oniisama.
There's something wrong when things like much needed character development and story have to take a backseat to "no, I do not want tea. I am not that thirsty yet. My oniisama who had to stand in the sun! What horror! Why must he be made to suffer so?!" ... Sheesh. A "no, thank you" would've done nicely.

You can say it's the "detractors" that are repetitive, but isn't it more accurate to say that the reason they are repetitive is because, well, the show is repetitive?
That said, I can understand that it is disappointing if a series you like isn't as well received as you'd have hoped. What I don't get is how wound up some people are about others being more critical. For example, I love SNK. Not everyone does. In fact, a lot of people bash it.
Does it mean I get mad and flame those people? Lol, no. Its their right to voice their opinion and what bothers them.

----

That said, I still like Mayumi. She's visually appealing and probably more interesting than the rest of the cast combined.
There should be a coup. Get rid of the current cast, make Mayumi the lead. I'd watch that.

[Kaengel]

What with this cliffhanger ? I guess it's a bad thing if everyone launch a magic spell at once because interaction between spells can get dangerous.

I was expecting the father to be some kind of asshole, and it's not the case. He gave me the vibes of the good guy trapped in a thorny path with the Yotsuba family...

[Benigmatica]

I'm glad that Ushiyama and his team at Four Leaves Technology has made mass-production of levitation magic possible now that Tatsuya perfected it last week.

On the other hand, I feel that Mayumi Saegusa wearing a casual dress is a change of pace to Miyuki's "Onii-sama!" moments.

[Mentar]

Yes, Faerie, it's your right to criticize the same things in here time and time again. Thank you for your valuable contributions, I'm certain that the vast majority of people who actually still enjoy the show to some degree will feel uplifted by your insights. And what's good 3 times must be more than twice as good 10 times, right?

Too good for me. Broken Record added to my Ignore List. Congrats, only 5 people managed to get there in my 11 years of membership on Animesuki.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by SigUp

Yeah, exactly ten of them. And going by Ushiyama's reaction this device was specifically designed for the purpose of a flying device. He immediately recognised it as such. Besides, Tatsuya stated he programmed that into the "mock-up" Ushiyama made, indicating that it isn't a standard part.

With the implication there should be a lot more.

Not consumer market stuff, but still - standard for a research lab that works on flying CADs.

[thundrakkon]

@Faerie

I'm guessing different people are focused on different things. It is true that people develop certain bias and opinions, and they focus on certain things to justify and reinforce their views. However, as I have posted in my TL;DR, which karice67 also gracefully pointed out, there was a lot of details and points in this episode that added so much information and plot that people seem to be ignoring. Why aren't we focused on those plot points, and there are plenty to choose from, instead of rehashing the same complaints?

Back to discussing the episode, it appears that the attack at the end of the episode is probably from the No Head Dragon organization. Besides being an international crime organization and based in Hong Kong, there is no other indication of what their purpose is. Why are they attacking? What are they after? What are they trying to prove?

Also, with Tatsuya and Miyuki going off to the competition, what happens with their friends that they left behind? Particularly, Erika, Leo, Mizuki, and Mikihiko? Are they going to disappear for the next few episodes, or will they play some relevance? Particularly, they introduced Mikihiko, so he definitely must be a factor at some point.

[TrueDevil]

Wow we are still pre competition, the pacing is really slow considering how many LN readers say stuff is missing I Guess most of us will fall asleep if they added all the things.
The butler sure is an asshole for no reason I mean even if he consider Tatsuya "only" as Miyukis bodyguard it is still an important role and he wont gain anything except Miyukis hatred. The father also seems like a major douche bag, its your son damnit at least show him some love. I assume he is just a wimp doing the homework while the mother is the head of the Shiba family or at least higher ranked as he is.
And those terrorists sure dont learn a thing, you will just get roflstomped by our holy siblings anyway.

[karice67]

Also, just noticed on a second watch through:



Looks like somebody cast magic on the bus wheels as it was braking and skidding.

So I went back to look more closely at the van going out of control, given that the driver seemed really out of it too, and here's what happened just before its wheel went bust:

=>

[itisjustme]

People keep rehashing the same points because the same points are pushed in our face every episode is my guess. :P

Tatsuya's missing emotions apparently but ofc he acts nothing like someone who actually has emotional disability and more like a cool headed typical Randian hero.

The constructive criticism thing, I find it funny people never lash and go "How dare you say this series is good! You better say this is subjective and argue your views and be constructive about it." Let's not be hypocritical here.

[karice67]

^
Can you point out someone who's said that this series is good then? (As opposed to someone who's said that they're enjoying it.)


Oh, and if this is what a Randian hero is

Generally a Randian hero is characterized by radical individualism, moral resolution, intelligence/aptitude, self-control, emotional discipline, and (frequently, but not always) attractive physical characteristics in the eyes of other Randian heroes. (Wiki)

where is the 'moral resolution' part in Tatsuya?

[itisjustme]

Originally Posted by karice67

^
Can you point out someone who's said that this series is good then? (As opposed to someone who's said that they're enjoying it.)


Oh, and if this is what a Randian hero is
where is the 'moral resolution' part in Tatsuya?

Oh jeebus. I wasn't referring to this show in particular but pretending there's no one who posts about liking this series is disingenuous. Good/like, that's semantics, both are subjective judgment of subjective value. People here post what they don't like anyway, you just don't enjoy seeing the same arguments in every episode thread. (because again the same points show up very ep)

Now moral resolution, you're clutching at straws here. :P 1) not every single trait has to be present and 2) Randian morality's really a celebration of selfishness and I could argue the show makes effort to make Tats look morally righteous but I don't want to go into some philosophical rant here. The point is Tatsuya acts nothing like someone who's emotionally crippled, hell Miyuki acts more like one.

[Mentar]

Originally Posted by itisjustme

People keep rehashing the same points because the same points are pushed in our face every episode is my guess. :P

We can see by your tongue-smiley that you are enjoying yourself. Please hide your trollish nature a bit more skillfully, your "it's only about the story, not about annoying the fans" narrative is crumbling.

In the meantime, thanks alot for your contributions, too. Nothing like going to 9 Motörhead concerts in sequence and complaining that the music is too loud after every one of them.

The constructive criticism thing, I find it funny people never lash and go "How dare you say this series is good! You better say this is subjective and argue your views and be constructive about it." Let's not be hypocritical here.

Not THAT surprising, since one side enjoys denigrating what they don't care for, while the other side defends what they like. Destroying is always easier than conserving and requires much less emotional investment.

I'm beginning to think that Larethian is right after all. Simply ignorelisting the Trolls improves the atmosphere.

[Sheba]

Of course we are hearing less of "I am enjoying it" or "I am liking it" posts in this subforum. Those who actually does are all driven away or don't want to speak in that "toxic" atmosphere. I have seen it happening during K-on's airing and various other shows that were polarizing or "cool to hate".

[karice67]

Originally Posted by itisjustme

Oh jeebus. I wasn't referring to this show in particular but pretending there's no one who posts about liking this series is disingenuous. Good/like, that's semantics, both are subjective judgment of subjective value. People here post what they don't like anyway, you just don't enjoy seeing the same arguments in every episode thread. (because again the same points show up very ep)

Well, given that you are saying it in an episode thread of a particular show...

No, there is a difference. 'Liking' something involves a subjective assessment, but claiming something is 'good' or 'bad' involves trying to make an objective assessment about it. People often like what they claim or argue is good, and dislike what they claim or argue is bad, but the actions involved are distinct.

For example, I can argue, with evidence, that Mahouka has been relatively 'bad' at depicting some character relationships, such as the supposed friendship between Honoka, Shizuku and Tatsuya (until this episode, we hadn't seen them interact since episode 2). However, whether I like or dislike this aspect of the show is another matter.

And I haven't seen anyone try to claim that this show is 'good', just people claiming that they like it. But I have seen a few people (most certainly not all the detractors) claiming that it is bad.

Most people probably don't pay attention to this difference - I'll leave it up to you whether you decide to consider it or not.

Originally Posted by itisjustme

Now moral resolution, you're clutching at straws here. :P 1) not every single trait has to be present and 2) Randian morality's really a celebration of selfishness and I could argue the show makes effort to make Tats look morally righteous but I don't want to go into some philosophical rant here. The point is Tatsuya acts nothing like someone who's emotionally crippled, hell Miyuki acts more like one.

Not being able to get angry, or to feel hatred, or (it is implied) other emotions, is not considered 'emotionally crippled'? Interesting pov.

[Anh_Minh]

Originally Posted by TrueDevil

I assume he is just a wimp doing the homework

Spoiler for anime-omitted detail:

He's the Vice-President in charge of FLT's R&D.

while the mother is the head of the Shiba family or at least higher ranked as he is.

Her sister is the head.

Originally Posted by kagato3

Note that the other Yotsuba butler seen in ep 7 was vastly more respectful to Tatsuya (even bowing to him something Aoki said was beneath him as a butler of the family) and is apparently in a position that he thinks nothing of questioning the head of the family if it is a good idea to leave things as they are

Several elements to that. One is that the Maya's butler isn't a petty asshole. No matter how high you are, you can be nice and polite to those below you.

Another is that he doesn't take Tatsuya for granted. He is, in fact, somewhat worried about Tatsuya turning on them (which also shows a healthy respect for Tatsuya's abilities). Aoki thinks that no matter what he does, Tatsuya won't hurt him. So far, he's been right. That behavior still seems high-risk, low return to me. Even discounting the risk from Miyuki's displeasure, which one really shouldn't do.

Originally Posted by miroku2192

So why can't Miyuki just Nilfheim the hell out of the car and freeze it in its path?

Because they don't want to be hit by a cold car either. All Niflheim does is lower the temperature within an area.

Originally Posted by karice67

Not bring able to get angry, or to feel hatred, or (it is implied) other emotions, is not considered 'emotionally crippled'? Interesting pov.

I think he's talking about behavior, not inner life. If we hadn't been told he's emotionally crippled, would we have seen anything but a rather stoic young man? He still forms friendships, he still got angry at Blanche (in, yes, a rather self-possessed way rather than a furniture chewing one), he was surprised to see his classmates cheering him on, he apparently likes to tease people, and so on. I think we've seen less emotion from Juumonji than from him (helped by the widely different screen times).

So is it all protective coloration, or is he exaggerating how little he feels?

[HayashiTakara]

Originally Posted by Ravagerblade

So more Of the Saegusa, not a bad idea! lol, I agree with the world building but we have to remember this is a series called The Irregular at Magic High School (not that really matters lol). But this is going into later LN territory.



....no, they're 11 months apart.

Oh? For some reason I remembered them saying April and May instead of April and March

[Chosen_Hero]

Originally Posted by Ravagerblade

lol He's the shining light at the end of the tunnel eh?

Of course didn't you see how they were praising the sun... I mean Tatsuya? It's like he's grossly Incandescent.