AnimeSuki Forums

ShadowSamurai365 · 2015-04-27, 22:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yan3242

Blondie and shinji combi is like a king and his jester

I still cant get over shirou way to always help other, i mean if i can help other i will but whats the point if you obviously and 100% cant do anything about it, did he ever heard the term "live to fight/save another day"?

I think Rin's statement about Shirou being twisted/broken is supposed to be the point of it.

Rev Okkin · 2015-04-28, 00:51

The flashback showed him trying to ignore people to try and help himself survive. This made him have a guilt complex which makes him help people ASAP and give him guilt when he can't.

For him, he "lived to fight" when he survived the fire. And now, he is trying to "save another day" by helping as much people as he can even at the cost of his life because, as he sees it, he died in that fire 10 years ago.

Yan3242 · 2015-04-28, 20:42

Guess the breaking point happen when he fight archer later and found out later it was his savior who cause the whole incident. It happen in ubw route right? I kind of forgot.

chaos_alfa · 2015-04-29, 04:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yan3242

Guess the breaking point happen when he fight archer later and found out later it was his savior who cause the whole incident. It happen in ubw route right? I kind of forgot.

It is only revealed in the Heaven's Feel route that Kiritsugu was the reason for the incident at the end of the 4th Grail War.

Lorhand · 2015-04-29, 05:20

Spoiler for Answer:

chaos_alfa · 2015-04-29, 10:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lorhand

Spoiler for Answer:

Seems I confused Kiritsugu's real nature and method of operation only getting revealed in Heaven's Feel with the reveal that he was responsible for the disaster.

Hm, now I'm not sure anymore if that was the case. Didn't Kirei also reveal the unsavoury stuff Kiristugu did in the Fate route?

Lorhand · 2015-04-29, 10:46

As far as I remember, Kirei makes it sound in Fate like his wish caused the fire, although he notes that no matter who would have used the Grail, the result would have been the same, since it interprets every wish in a destructive way.

Kiritsugu's true nature is only revealed by Kirei in HF, you're right about that. In Fate you learn he was Saber's Master, didn't get along with her, defeated Kirei and ordered Saber to destroy the Grail. In UBW, you learn indirectly in Ilya's flashback, that he fought for the Einzberns.

Dengar · 2015-04-29, 13:53

Kotomine likes to think he caused the fire. And it WAS more or less what he wished for at the time.

Geburah · 2015-05-01, 09:56

Can someone refresh me if in the VN Herakles got wounded by the wolves? As far as i know even with having God Hand turned off servants are inmune to any kind of conventional atack so wolves shouldnt been able to hurt Herakles at all

GreyZone · 2015-05-01, 11:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geburah

Can someone refresh me if in the VN Herakles got wounded by the wolves? As far as i know even with having God Hand turned off servants are inmune to any kind of conventional atack so wolves shouldnt been able to hurt Herakles at all

Magical wolfs with A rank fangs

bhl88 · 2015-05-02, 19:39

Heracles bleeds with anything but he doesn't die. So I guess wolves didn't reduce even 1 life.

Geburah · 2015-05-02, 19:58

Remember that in the VN Archer eats a Kuzuki blow in the face after he has no magic enhancement, and he deals no damage to him at all when its strong enough to kill a person and Archer didnt even bother to block it.

You could shoot Caster in the face with a Magnum and it would deal 0 damage to her since a servant are a supernatural being and inmune to every common weapon/damage sans magic/conceptual weapons and similar

GreyZone · 2015-05-02, 21:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geburah

Remember that in the VN Archer eats a Kuzuki blow in the face after he has no magic enhancement, and he deals no damage to him at all when its strong enough to kill a person and Archer didnt even bother to block it.

You could shoot Caster in the face with a Magnum and it would deal 0 damage to her since a servant are a supernatural being and inmune to every common weapon/damage sans magic/conceptual weapons and similar

What? I never heard about that (refering to Archer taking an attack to the face)... also due to Mahoutsukai we know that Kuzuki can damage servants even without magic enhancements, probably.

Lorhand · 2015-05-02, 21:38

Shirou has the option to try to stop Kuzuki, when he wants to attack Archer, or not. In one choice, Archer will dodge Kuzuki's attacks and then stab him, in the other one, Archer will tank the hit to the face and then slash Kuzuki.

Anyway, wrong episode, I think.

TwilightsCall · 2015-05-05, 10:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by GreyZone

What? I never heard about that (refering to Archer taking an attack to the face)... also due to Mahoutsukai we know that Kuzuki can damage servants even without magic enhancements, probably.

The specific example aside, It's stated rather clearly in Fate route (shortly after the first encounter with Berserker) that conventional arms can't harm servants.

To quote:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fate

But since the Servants can affect the real world as spirits, you could call them the most powerful weapon.

With the technology we have now, there are no weapons that can affect a spiritual being. Our attacks are useless against them, and their attacks can damage us. It's not just a one-sided game. Murder by a Servant is like a natural death for normal people.

Death caused by an invisible killer will just be treated as accidental death or suicide.

And going back to said example,

Spoiler for Episode 17:

GreyZone · 2015-05-05, 11:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by TwilightsCall

The specific example aside, It's stated rather clearly in Fate route (shortly after the first encounter with Berserker) that conventional arms can't harm servants.

Yes I know that, I was actually refering to a spoiler from Mahoyo, where it suppoedly was stated that the fighting style that Kuzuki uses includes the ability to "ignore concepts", like the concept of invincibility or intangability, but maybe I got that wrong, or Kuzuki can actually do it, but simply has insufficient strenght to break through Archer's defense by himself.

Dengar · 2015-05-06, 02:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Geburah

Remember that in the VN Archer eats a Kuzuki blow in the face after he has no magic enhancement, and he deals no damage to him at all when its strong enough to kill a person and Archer didnt even bother to block it.

You could shoot Caster in the face with a Magnum and it would deal 0 damage to her since a servant are a supernatural being and inmune to every common weapon/damage sans magic/conceptual weapons and similar

Shooting Caster in the face probably would deal a ton of damage really. The problem is actually shooting her in the face.

Berserker would probably feel little because of special abilities.

Guido · 2015-09-11, 19:20

Thankfully, Shiro made it through from the previous episode's cliffhanger.

Broken, that's the word that came to my mind when Shirou pull out a particular gesture to Tohsaka at explaining his actions to put others safety and happiness before his.

Honestly, Kiritsugu would have neither intended nor condoned for Shiro to be a hero saving everyone out there in the entire world; that's not possible.

Each one of us gets one, just one shot at life, and there lies within us to seek the answer how we want to face and live our lives.

In regard for Kuzuki's reply to Archer's last question, changing the subject, I interpret that the good and evil in each one of us is something we have to deal every day in our lives, and settling the outcome of our inner struggles never ceases; we're human and flawed, bounded to fail and to commit mistakes.

Applying at how much Shiro's suffering upholding his ideals, he's losing it or will eventually lose himself, if he cannot admit that more than his ideal to be flawed it is himself that is flawed and no one expects him to save literally everyone.

Now, if there's one thing that surely rose my spirits in this episode was watching Rin flustering, blushing, and bickering with Shiro over who would get to deal with Lancer. Oh man, those tsundere Rin moments came in handy in order to lighten up the mood.

View Poll Results: F/SN UBW TV - Episode 16 Rating
Perfect 10	10	30.30%
9 out of 10 : Excellent	14	42.42%
8 out of 10 : Very Good	7	21.21%
7 out of 10 : Good	2	6.06%
6 out of 10 : Average	0	0%
5 out of 10 : Below Average	0	0%
4 out of 10 : Poor	0	0%
3 out of 10 : Bad	0	0%
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1 out of 10 : Painful	0	0%
Voters: 33. You may not vote on this poll

2015-04-28, 00:51	Link #62
Rev Okkin Yorokobe, (Insert name) Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: Auckland, New Zealand	The flashback showed him trying to ignore people to try and help himself survive. This made him have a guilt complex which makes him help people ASAP and give him guilt when he can't. For him, he "lived to fight" when he survived the fire. And now, he is trying to "save another day" by helping as much people as he can even at the cost of his life because, as he sees it, he died in that fire 10 years ago. __________________ Random Thoughts: I will only judge anime by its BD version. #nostupidcensors #nostupidmissingscenes #betteranimation #betterediting

2015-04-29, 05:20	Link #65
Lorhand Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2013	Spoiler for Answer: A tragedy without any survivors. Kiritsugu, the one who caused it, must have frantically searched for a survivor. And he finally found a survivor that should not have existed. The man found a surviving child that could not be saved. If you talk about miracles, it is…

2015-04-29, 10:46	Link #67
Lorhand Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2013	As far as I remember, Kirei makes it sound in Fate like his wish caused the fire, although he notes that no matter who would have used the Grail, the result would have been the same, since it interprets every wish in a destructive way. Kiritsugu's true nature is only revealed by Kirei in HF, you're right about that. In Fate you learn he was Saber's Master, didn't get along with her, defeated Kirei and ordered Saber to destroy the Grail. In UBW, you learn indirectly in Ilya's flashback, that he fought for the Einzberns. Last edited by Lorhand; 2015-04-29 at 11:36.

2015-05-02, 19:39	Link #71
bhl88 Otaku Apprentice Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: The Unseen Horizon	Heracles bleeds with anything but he doesn't die. So I guess wolves didn't reduce even 1 life. __________________ OS-tan Collections (temporary): https://discord.gg/Hv2rBs3

2015-04-28, 20:42	Link #63
Yan3242 Senior Member Join Date: Aug 2014	Guess the breaking point happen when he fight archer later and found out later it was his savior who cause the whole incident. It happen in ubw route right? I kind of forgot.

2015-04-29, 13:53	Link #68
Dengar Kamen Rider Muppeteer Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Unknown Age: 39	Kotomine likes to think he caused the fire. And it WAS more or less what he wished for at the time.

2015-05-01, 09:56	Link #69
Geburah Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007	Can someone refresh me if in the VN Herakles got wounded by the wolves? As far as i know even with having God Hand turned off servants are inmune to any kind of conventional atack so wolves shouldnt been able to hurt Herakles at all

2015-05-02, 19:58	Link #72
Geburah Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2007	Remember that in the VN Archer eats a Kuzuki blow in the face after he has no magic enhancement, and he deals no damage to him at all when its strong enough to kill a person and Archer didnt even bother to block it. You could shoot Caster in the face with a Magnum and it would deal 0 damage to her since a servant are a supernatural being and inmune to every common weapon/damage sans magic/conceptual weapons and similar

2015-05-02, 21:38	Link #74
Lorhand Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2013	Shirou has the option to try to stop Kuzuki, when he wants to attack Archer, or not. In one choice, Archer will dodge Kuzuki's attacks and then stab him, in the other one, Archer will tank the hit to the face and then slash Kuzuki. Anyway, wrong episode, I think.

2015-09-11, 19:20	Link #78
Guido Snobby Gentleman Join Date: May 2004 Location: Monterrey, México Age: 43	Fate/stay night 16 - Winter Days, the Form Wishes Take Thankfully, Shiro made it through from the previous episode's cliffhanger. Broken, that's the word that came to my mind when Shirou pull out a particular gesture to Tohsaka at explaining his actions to put others safety and happiness before his. Honestly, Kiritsugu would have neither intended nor condoned for Shiro to be a hero saving everyone out there in the entire world; that's not possible. Each one of us gets one, just one shot at life, and there lies within us to seek the answer how we want to face and live our lives. In regard for Kuzuki's reply to Archer's last question, changing the subject, I interpret that the good and evil in each one of us is something we have to deal every day in our lives, and settling the outcome of our inner struggles never ceases; we're human and flawed, bounded to fail and to commit mistakes. Applying at how much Shiro's suffering upholding his ideals, he's losing it or will eventually lose himself, if he cannot admit that more than his ideal to be flawed it is himself that is flawed and no one expects him to save literally everyone. Now, if there's one thing that surely rose my spirits in this episode was watching Rin flustering, blushing, and bickering with Shiro over who would get to deal with Lancer. Oh man, those tsundere Rin moments came in handy in order to lighten up the mood.