F/SN UBW TV - Episode 10 Spoiler Discussion / Poll

[Mad Pierrot]

[R.LocK]

Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor

And you think your oh-so-good judgment and personal standard can invalidate how others feel?

LOL nuff said.

Wow, hey, I'll be a prick to the guy who is a prick to the other guy, so I'm in the right, but the prick'll eat shit. I guess, it's a bit awkward to hide your halo every time you talk to others.

[Subarunyon II]

Originally Posted by R.LocK

Wow, hey, I'll be a prick to the guy who is a prick to the other guy, so I'm in the right, but the prick'll eat shit. I guess, it's a bit awkward to hide your halo every time you talk to others.

He was only commenting that he thinks the OST is finally good this episode, and he's free to think that way. I think you were the one that was trying to invalidate his thoughts. You can always add IMO yourself on anything you read in an internet forum, or really any human conversation that is subjective judgement. Can you imagine if everyone says imo every single time they say something that's not factual?

He even stated explicitly in his reply that his comment is only subjective, but you keep pushing to pass off your opinion as the only one that's true.

Fact is that this episode is the first time I, personally feel my adrenaline rushing from hearing the ost, so I dont disagree with his statement that the ost is finally effective at complimenting the animation.

[R.LocK]

Originally Posted by Subarunyon II

He was commenting on how he thinks the OST is finally good this episode. I think you were the one that was trying to invalidate his thoughts. I think you can always add IMO yourself on anything you read in an internet forum, or really any human conversation that is subjective judgement.

...Thank you for faithfully conveying his message to me~. Anyway, my post flew over your head. However, I'd like unrelated people stay unrelated in case of the mod check.

[cupumanager]

Question: Do in the original VN, has Emiya Kiritsugu ever shown in flashbacks, or just told?

I feel resemblance in appearance between him and Kuzuki. Is either one affect the other, in character design,or just because of their shared trade of professional killing?

And, Enhanced Kuzuki far more powerful than Kirei in his prime?

[Lorhand]

Originally Posted by cupumanager

Question: Do in the original VN, has Emiya Kiritsugu ever shown in flashbacks, or just told?

I feel resemblance in appearance between him and Kuzuki. Is either one affect the other, in character design,or just because of their shared trade of professional killing?

And, Enhanced Kuzuki far more powerful than Kirei in his prime?

Scenes like Kiritsugu saving Shirou, meeting him in the hospital and passing his dream to Shirou are all in the VN.

Kiritsugu looks like Gun God from Angel Notes. Kuzuki looks like

Spoiler for other Type-Moon Work:

an older and rougher Shizuki Soujuurou to me. Soujuurou's original design was inherited by Kuzuki actually.

If Kuzuki is allowed to be enhanced, does Kirei have his Command Spells to buff himself? Either way, Kirei will lose the first battle against Kuzuki, because of Kuzuki's unorthodox technique, which even caught Saber offguard.

[Tenzen12]

Originally Posted by goblehook

Really? I'm under the impression that he doesn't block attacks that he can't meet. He either parries, avoids or counters attacks that are beyond him. While using feign and anticipation to move before his enemies when lacking in speed.

Kojiros official stats are:
STR - C (stronger than Archer and Rider)
CON - E
AGI - A+ (FAR faster than Saber)
LCK - A ( luckier than Lancer)

In their battle Saber is slow but strong and Kojiro weak but fast, he also couldn't meet Sabers attacks for another reason: His katana would be damaged by far more superior Excalibur.

Btw: While I said "slow" in saber case it's still mean being able run on water while avoiding NP gattling fire, remember?

[R.LocK]

Saber's able to stand on the water surface due to fairies' blessing hence pool training in HA. Lancer and True Assassin, on the other hand, are fully capable of running on water. Also, Saber's far stronger under Kiritsugu's command.

[Cloudedmind]

Originally Posted by Obelisk ze Tormentor

Eh, what applies to guns also applies to traditional weapons though. Anyone can use it as long as they train and practice. But, like in any other aspects of life, there are individuals who are gifted with the weapons more than everybody else. Chu can handle spear better than most people is just like Ethan Hunt or Jason Borne that can aim their guns better and shoot faster than most people with the same weapons (I use fictional characters as examples coz F/SN also use fictional characters).

How about someone like Rambo or James Bond that can took out multiple guys with firearms? Yes, they use guns, but we can see that the guns (and bazooka, and chopper, and tanks) don’t discredit their skills and accomplishments more than past heroes. So yeah, I found that reason a bit strange since every type of hand-held practical weapons practically has the same principle (unless you’re talking about martial arts that come with the traditional weapons). IMO It’s more how you use the weapons and for what.

This so much, the same principle pretty much goes for any type of handheld weapon. Anyone can learn how to use one as long as they get training, that shouldn't negate the skills of a user who really knows how to use theirs well.

Originally Posted by TwilightsCall

The main difference is how they are regarded by the general population though. The idea is that in the past, when someone was a Hero, like King Arthur, they were thought to be super, beyond human existences that couldn't be reached by a normal person - they had magic, or were blessed by the gods, or some other equally significant thing changed them from being human into something more.

In contrast, when we think of people who are "heroes" nowadays, like in your example Ethan Hunt or Jason Bourne, people don't look at them as "super-human existences." They are seen as people who trained all their lives, and with the right mix of natural talent and hard work, accomplished what they have via their own, human means. Because they are looked at as "incredibly skilled individuals" instead of "super-human individuals," they aren't afforded the same kind of "worship" past heroes were, and so don't qualify to be sent to the Throne of Heroes.

Fundamentally, I don't see anything preventing future heroes from coming into being, but there needs to be that added layer of mystique returned, something that makes them be regarded as above human. So actually, something like a Jedi is probably fairly close to being applicable for the category.

Spoiler for Angel Notes:

Though sorry, Humans die out before Jedis can ever be a thing in the Nasuverse

Now, this makes more sense. I can see how modern peoples change in perception of these types of people could have an effect on whether someone becomes a Heroic Spirit or not. We may praise and admire someone's skill but we're not likely to worship them as gods for it. But just the pure notion of anyone can pick up a gun and learn how to use, is no different then anyone can pick up a sword and learn how to use it.

[Tenzen12]

Originally Posted by R.LocK

Saber's able to stand on the water surface due to fairies' blessing hence pool training in HA. Lancer and True Assassin, on the other hand, are fully capable of running on water. Also, Saber's far stronger under Kiritsugu's command.

Fair enough. Well I don't think it change a lot about my point (feel free correct me if I am wrong again)

[R.LocK]

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

Fair enough. Well I don't think it change a lot about my point (feel free correct me if I am wrong again)

Well, Saber's a bit slower with her master being Shirou. So, Gatling Gun example may be a bit stretching. Anyway, I had a good laugh with Luck comparison with Lancer.

[cupumanager]

Originally Posted by Kanon

Archer's flashback was weird. It looked like it took place in a distant past (what with people using polearms and swords), but all we know he's from the future. What was that?

I'm as baffled as you are. He's from the future, but why is the vision of his past is so far in the past?

Then I thought, perhaps its not HIS own personal memories, but its the memories of the weapons he projected. That makes more sense.

About weapons, his Bow and and Armor are actually futurisic after all. Modern person can be a Counter Guardian, if not the usual Heroic Spirit. This means Modern Guardians would be able to wield their modern or futuristic weapon; but they and their weapon would not get the boosts nor the status of NP like the legendary heroes of old.

[Dengar]

Can anyone PLEASE tell me what gives them the idea that that event is "somewhere in the past"?

[cupumanager]

Nope, I'm aware that its should be something NOT in the past.

[Kimiko Khan]

it seems people are mistaking the reality marble for a battlefield in the past. also all those weapons piercing him is symbolic of his own ideals killing him

[Tenzen12]

And what kind of symbolism was these armored people near castle-like bulding and Gallows?

[Kimiko Khan]

forgive me not sure how i glossed over that. i'm assuming the flash backs are the various places he was summoned to as a counter guardian. as a counter guardian he's not bound to his time, he's summoned by the world to where ever/ when ever he's needed. I'm guessing the gallows part was when he failed to save a bunch of people and was made as the scapegoat for the whole incident. though then again he only became a counter guardian after his own death. so i'm not sure. perhaps its an instance of one of the times he was summoned?

[Kimiko Khan]

after rewatching that opening scene. it does make sense for those flash backs to be various instances of him being summoned to stop events and then subsequently being killed. especially when considering he had to kill a lot of people to stop those events( a parallel to kiritsugu choosing to kill the few to save the many.). As to the part where he's in the reality marble pierced by all those weapons, it still works as symbolism for his ideals killing him

[cupumanager]

Originally Posted by Kimiko Khan

forgive me not sure how i glossed over that. i'm assuming the flash backs are the various places he was summoned to as a counter guardian. as a counter guardian he's not bound to his time, he's summoned by the world to where ever/ when ever he's needed. I'm guessing the gallows part was when he failed to save a bunch of people and was made as the scapegoat for the whole incident. though then again he only became a counter guardian after his own death. so i'm not sure. perhaps its an instance of one of the times he was summoned?

Ah, if put that way that does makes sense...so in a way, it IS in the past...

[Lhklan]

Originally Posted by Kimiko Khan

after rewatching that opening scene. it does make sense for those flash backs to be various instances of him being summoned to stop events and then subsequently being killed. especially when considering he had to kill a lot of people to stop those events( a parallel to kiritsugu choosing to kill the few to save the many.). As to the part where he's in the reality marble pierced by all those weapons, it still works as symbolism for his ideals killing him

I'm pretty sure that being summoned as a CG means that he's being a unstoppable force of nature, not some kind of one man killing machine.

Not to mention that I distinctly remember reading something about the one being summoned being a copy of the original that reside in the ToH, so Archer himself shouldn't even have those memories, merely only know them.

Now, if that was his death, maybe it took place in some out of place country that still practice medieval execution?