Code Geass R2 - Overall Series Impressions & Total Series Rating

[demon_god04]

And fundamentally there are people that just do not agree his method could have worked the way he wanted to in season one and that essentially he was just a hypocrite in that he did not really want to change things. He just wanted to die a martyr to alleviate his own guilt.

[Eliarine]

Originally Posted by Levy

Idk, I've always like him... but most of the opinions I've heard on the matter can be summarizzed in
a) he is not Lelouch

Basically, this.

[bladeofdarkness]

in season 1 yeah
in season 2 however he has other reasons

[Charred Knight]

Originally Posted by Spring_sakura111

I've been wondering..
Why do people hate Suzaku? Especially during Season one?

For me it was the fact that Britannia was presented as irredeemable, it seems like Suzaku was an idiot who didn't understand that he was fighting with evil racist monsters, who didn't respect hin, and would kill him if he wasn't a Britannian soldier. The staff failed to remember that they needed to present ordinary Britannians in a sympathetic light.

For the second season it was because he kept on changing from an idealist to a Well intentioned extremist depending on what the plot needs. It was just like in Seed Destiny where Shinn's sanity changed whenever he needed to be a good guy or a bad guy.

[NyxOne]

Okay, you totally forgot about Ashford, and Lloyd and Cecile who actually care for Suzaku, but I digress.

[Charred Knight]

Originally Posted by NyxOne

Okay, you totally forgot about Ashford, and Lloyd and Cecile who actually care for Suzaku, but I digress.

Those are not normal people, I am talking about the average soldier, nameless, and completely unimportant.

Ashford in particular was nothing more than a presentation of Lelouch's ideal world so Ashford rarely came off as a realistic place, it was a fairy tale land like Candyland.

[NyxOne]

Yeah, we're not supposed to care about the average mook.

[Charred Knight]

Originally Posted by NyxOne

Yeah, we're not supposed to care about the average mook.

It is with the average mook that we see the true face of a nation, one of my favorite things about Volume 15 of Fullmetal Alchemist is that you see the average mook being portrayed sympathetically, they don't want to be in Ishval killing those they wish to protect. Only a few people wanting power, or those insane like Kimblee want to be there.

On the other hand with Britannia they just want to be there so they can kill Japanese.

[bladeofdarkness]

what mooks
every britannian commander has been shown as a basterd from day one
clovis was ready to massacre shinjiku ghetto just to cover up his fuck ups
cornellia replicated the act for no reason other then as a trap to zero
carlares (the guy in R2) was shown as an ass (staging public executings)
gillford at least commented that its in poor taste, but he was ready to execute the entire OOBK just to lure zero out
and from the looks of things this is all standard practice
considering what charles was like this is no surprise

suzaku was the "hero" of the ass-hole team
working under their command
and in season 2 becoming one of them

[Grey Dawn]

In Guilford's defense, executing terrorists isn't exactly an atrocity, especially when it becomes obvious those terrorists have a dangerous foe looking to bust them out.

I think Charred_Knight is more reffering to the reactions of the mooks in stage 22. Euphemia orders them to commit genocide, they do it practically without question once it becomes obvious that she's serious.

[NyxOne]

Code Geass isn't FMA.

[Charred Knight]

Originally Posted by Grey Dawn

In Guilford's defense, executing terrorists isn't exactly an atrocity, especially when it becomes obvious those terrorists have a dangerous foe looking to bust them out.

I think Charred_Knight is more reffering to the reactions of the mooks in stage 22. Euphemia orders them to commit genocide, they do it practically without question once it becomes obvious that she's serious.

Also the first episode, and any time a massacre happens. At no point in time do you ever see the soldiers question their orders.

Originally Posted by NyxOne

Code Geass isn't FMA.

I am just pointing out that if they wanted the audience to sympathize with Suzaku than his side should have been portrayed in a better light than one person who was actually nice, a second whose basically a mad scientist, and a bunch of people who reside in a repersentation of Lelouch's ideal world.

It's kind of like trying to be portray anyone in the Titans, or Zanscare Empire with sympathy, it can't be done.

[bladeofdarkness]

suzaku is much more "heroic" of a character then lelouch is
thats the only thing that made for a good conflict in season 1
without him as the central "britannian" character it would just be lelouch (gray) against britannia (black)

but then in season 2 he lost everything that made him likeble in season 1
he wasnt idealistic anymore (he sold out his friends for power, and was using nunnaly against him)
he wasnt heroic anymore since he had a better mecha them most, and was never alone in battle against the OOBK at least
he went from being a lone pilot against multipe enemies to being the guy commanding a huge fleet trying to find one small ship

[NyxOne]

Emma Sheen, Charred?

[Maxmillian]

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

suzaku is much more "heroic" of a character then lelouch is
thats the only thing that made for a good conflict in season 1
without him as the central "britannian" character it would just be lelouch (gray) against britannia (black)

but then in season 2 he lost everything that made him likeble in season 1
he wasnt idealistic anymore (he sold out his friends for power, and was using nunnaly against him)
he wasnt heroic anymore since he had a better mecha them most, and was never alone in battle against the OOBK at least
he went from being a lone pilot against multipe enemies to being the guy commanding a huge fleet trying to find one small ship

Could you be anymore bias or were you blind this entire season, his reasons for handing Lelouch over was the sheer fact that he killed the person he loved in front of his eyes and showed no remorse for it, and used Nunnally for anything except to snuff he out in episode 5. It's funnyhow some fans can overlook Lelouch's actions over Suzaku's.

[Maxmillian]

Originally Posted by Levy

I'd love to know the reason of the to month's skip - that could be,"wait a decent time to persuade the world I'm really evil"- but moreover, the reason for the one month skip in ep.21. That, I've never understood why ?_?



Idk, I've always like him... but most of the opinions I've heard on the matter can be summarizzed in
a) he is not Lelouch
b) he's obstaculating Lelouch
c) the rebel is always the most appealing one
d) Suzaku's attempa to change things from the inside was percieved as hypocrisy.

You hit the nail on the head my friend.

[Charred Knight]

Originally Posted by NyxOne

Emma Sheen, Charred?

How many episodes until she defected? 3?

I just checked she defected 4 episodes into the series.

After a certain amount of massacres in which the people doing to killing show no regret its impossible to feel sympathetic.

[bladeofdarkness]

Originally Posted by Maxmillian

Could you be anymore bias or were you blind this entire season, his reasons for handing Lelouch over was the sheer fact that he killed the person he loved in front of his eyes and showed no remorse for it, and used Nunnally for anything except to snuff he out in episode 5. It's funnyhow some fans can overlook Lelouch's actions over Suzaku's.

i point out that suzaku went from idealist in season 1 to knight templar in season 2
how is that bias
it happened

i actually LIKED him in season 1
i didnt this season
and its becouse all the things i like about him died off
he was like lelouch in terms of morality (as in, what ever it takes)
only without any positive traits to balance it out
no mortality pet
no relationship with other character to make him seem human (aside form gino, and even thats strained)
and no sheer awesomeness

and i actually felt for him after euphie died
but the answer to lelouch's actions should have been a bullet between the eyes
that i would more then except
selling him out to be used as bait (and then killed) in exchange for power and position i cant

[Maxmillian]

Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness

i point out that suzaku went from idealist in season 1 to knight templar in season 2
how is that bias
it happened

i actually LIKED him in season 1
i didnt this season
and its becouse all the things i like about him died off
he was like lelouch in terms of morality (as in, what ever it takes)
only without any positive traits to balance it out
no mortality pet
no relationship with other character to make him seem human (aside form gino, and even thats strained)
and no sheer awesomeness

and i actually felt for him after euphie died
but the answer to lelouch's actions should have been a bullet between the eyes
that i would more then except
selling him out to be used as bait (and then killed) in exchange for power and position i cant

I suppose you'll go for killing siblings for blind ambition over betraying a bastard in the first place. Anyway it was quite obvious that his season one persona didn't do him any good regardless it only ended up with him killing 35 million (10 million) innocent civilians because of it. Eh? I got nothing! they did ruin his character in R2.

[Sonae]

R1!Suzaku = <3
R2!Suzaku = meh...

He was better in R1. In R2 he was only a cold, unattached, Euphie obsessing bastard. But what made me not hate him, is the fact that he felt for Lelouch's death.