Aldnoah.Zero - Episode 19 Discussion / Poll

[Dauerlutscher]

Originally Posted by Terrestrial Dream

Eh, I don't read every topic. But I really don't see Slaine's action as genocide. But if you can interpret it that way, fine I guess.

Like I said, Taking part in the murder of millions of people is genocide. By assisting and supporting Saaz, Slaine was willingly taking part in that.
http://www.un.org/en/preventgenocide..._framework.pdf
There is no room for interpretations. Slaine was and is part of that.

[blakstealth]

Asseylum's baaack. fuck the rest!

[endarion88]

anyway now unless inaho can really take all of mars army on is pretty over for terrans...theyr leaders are idiots, seylum lost her memory (yay overused shit again ) and as inaho said in this episode, at this point fake or real doesn't matter she wont be able to stop things anymore

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by monster

Slaine doesn't dictate how Mars should conquer Earth, but he is still the one who pushes the counts to focus on conquering Earth and leave the details to them. Some counts are careful in what destructions they cause and others may not be as careful. Also, one reason why they don't indiscriminately attack is because they want to preserve the Earth for themselves.

And regardless if Slaine himself only attacks military targets, Mars is still the aggressor in this conflict. So those military targets are people who are only defending themselves against the invading Martians. He does not need to personally commit or command actual genocide in order to be considered at fault for what he and/or the people under him does and/or has done in this conflict.

Well, if you want he could simply drop out all together, just stop doing anything. Would that really change the fact that a war is going on? Would it stop the war? No. Honestly, at least they show that Slaine can guide the counts. If he wasn't there, they would be killing indiscriminately anyway.

And at this point, it really doesn't matter that they Terrans are defending themselves. Terrans soldiers are defending themselves and Martians are defending themselves. This is still war. Once a war has spread out to this degree, it really no longer matters who started it. War is not that simple. You can decide who to blame when it's over, right now it's just a matter of survival. The Terrans will kill Martians and the Martians have the right to defend themselves. I'm not saying that the war is right, but I am saying there is no easy solution to it either.

Originally Posted by Dauerlutscher

Like I said, Taking part in the murder of millions of people is genocide. By assisting and supporting Saaz, Slaine was willingly taking part in that.
http://www.un.org/en/preventgenocide..._framework.pdf
There is no room for interpretations. Slaine was and is part of that.

Since some of us clearly disagree with you, there IS room for interpretations. We do have our own opinions. By your definition, that means that every one who "assisted and supported" Saaz is also guilty of genocide, including every soldier and worker on that moon base, Lemrina, and even Eddelrittuo, even though some like Eddelrittuo, Harklight, and Slaine, were never loyal to Saazbaum. Honestly, if Slaine was just going to do what Saaz was going to do, he could have let the man finish his plan and then kill him when it was all over. The fact that he didn't shows that he's planning on going another way. Slaine took up Saaz's cause, but not necessarily his plan.

[Dauerlutscher]

It's just like you would say it doesn't matter thet Hintler and the Nazis startet WW2...

Millions, if not billions, of civilists died because of Vers....but hey, it doesn't matter that they are responsible...

[Terrestrial Dream]

Originally Posted by Raziel1991

episode 10

Yuki: If this place is destroyed... Terrans might go extinct (18:17)

Sounds like genocide to me. In other words, Slaine is leading the genocidial invasion Saazbaum started.

I see that line more as Terran will lose than all of humans will die.

Originally Posted by Dauerlutscher

Like I said, Taking part in the murder of millions of people is genocide. By assisting and supporting Saaz, Slaine was willingly taking part in that.
http://www.un.org/en/preventgenocide..._framework.pdf
There is no room for interpretations. Slaine was and is part of that.

But the key line there is "intent", yes?
I believed the war is for territory and resources. There is a room for interpretation.

[bastek66]

Originally Posted by Dauerlutscher

Maybe he will get to the Supervillain level of Bizon from Buddy Complex...

Butthurt
In
Zogilia
Over
NTR

[Dauerlutscher]

Originally Posted by Terrestrial Dream

I see that line more as Terran will lose than all of humans will die.

But the key line there is "intent", yes?
I believed the war is for territory and resources. There is a room for interpretation.

Hitler also wantet territory and ressources, and the way to get them was through genocide. And Vers is doing exactly the same...

[jpwong]

Originally Posted by lubczyk

I see three possibilities in the upcoming battle:

1. Both forces come to a stalemate and withdraw.

2. Inaho figures out a way to defeat 4 counts and 2 landing castles by himself (The height of nonsense prediction, but par for the course for this series).

3. We continue with Slaine's conflicted feelings from this episode, and he turns on his Vers allies. He assists Inaho and Co. in winning the battle for Earth. That way, he can take Inaho to Asseylum. Inaho and Slaine have a makeup session for their disagreement in episode 7.

Well we know not everyone agrees with Slaine yet, we could have a third landing castle show up with one of the not yet allied counts. If it's one of those ones frothing for personal honour in battle above everything (someone like Vlad) they aren't just going to buddy up with the plan, and that friction between the counts could let them escape.

[Terrestrial Dream]

Originally Posted by Dauerlutscher

Hitler also wantet territory and ressources, and the way to get them was through genocide. And Vers is doing exactly the same...

...what? Genocide was not a way for Hitler to get resources and territory.
I am pretty sure the holocaust hindered Nazi's war effort instead of helping it.

The only reasonable comparison you can make is Nazi and Russia, where Hitler wanted more territory for his people and he invaded Russia to take it from them. And yes shit tons of Russians died but no one call that a genocide.

[hamazura]

go go slaine! this guy rocks, total space nazi stalin or whatever lol
this guy is just so cool... his development just wow. climb up from filthy peasant to highest in power.
but i think he will get backstabbed tho... by lemrina, eldritto...
and harklight seems loyal. its like light yagami and teru mikami kind of relationship

i doubt princess will die for real. she died too many times already.
and probably slaine and inaho will both die
i dont want inaho to survive, if the most interesting character slaine died, inaho have to go down with him. its just too unfair how this show treated inaho and slaine.

[Dauerlutscher]

The Terrans are on earth, Vers wants Earth and territory and ressources. The Terrans won't give up their territory and resources. Vers kills millions of people so the can have this territory and resources.

The Terrans are in the way, so Vers is murdering them.

Simple and without a doubt, genocide.

[Irenesharda]

Originally Posted by Dauerlutscher

Hitler also wantet territory and ressources, and the way to get them was through genocide. And Vers is doing exactly the same...

Slaine may have done some shady things, but a Hitler he is not. If you really want to point at the Hitler figure of this series, it's Asseylum and Lemrina's father, Gilzera. Who knowingly knew of what was going on with the lower classes of Vers, but then used the Terrans as a scapegoat and had everyone blame them and want to go to war against them for the resources of Earth that should be theirs. The guy was filled with propaganda and hid the true problems of Vers under that veneer of hate. He started first war in the first place.

Saazbaum saw the truth after Orlane died, but he was so full of hatred and he had had no connection to Earth and Terrans, that while he didn't hate them, he had no problem killing them and taking the resources for Vers.

As for Slaine, he wants to change things for the lower classes of Vers, but like Saaz and Gilzera, knows that the problem is in the fact that Vers has no resources and it needs them. However, by the point that Slaine really can do much of anything with any kind of power, the war has gone on for so long that there is really no easy end to it. If he goes against the war, then he loses his power and standing and will be pushed to the sidelines and be able to do nothing. So, he goes along with the same attitude that all the others have, and he is working to end the war. It just may not be the way that Asseylum would have wanted, and at this point he seems okay with that now.

No matter if you want the Terrans to win, the problem that has been there since the beginning, that keeps sparking these wars, is that Vers needs resources and they need a change in their government. If you don't do anything about this, another war is just going to bloom later on. If they don't correct this problem than nothing will change. Even Count Mazuurek is taking Earth's resources for his own. I don't know how they will work this all out, but they will have to find a way to address those main problem in Vers, or else this will be a continuous cycle.

[Terrestrial Dream]

Originally Posted by Dauerlutscher

The Terrans are on earth, Vers wants Earth and territory and ressources. The Terrans won't give up their territory and resources. Vers kills millions of people so the can have this territory and resources.

The Terrans are in the way, so Vers is murdering them.

Simple and without a doubt, genocide.

By your definition every war is genocide.

[XFire]

Originally Posted by blakstealth

Asseylum's baaack. fuck the rest!

Comrade!!!!!

Seriously though, this basically seemed like the beginning of the end. Slaine says he's too far gone to come back, Asseylum is awake and beginning to remember Inaho, and Inaho is finally in a dicey situation (which we all know he'll shoot his way out of).

Current Predictions for the ending.....

The Sad One

• Slaine is killed by Inaho
• Lemrina dies with Slaine (insert "dying with the one you love" scene)
• Asseylum dies destroying the Aldnoah, Inaho goes with her
• The Vers Empire falls apart, and the people are forced to move to Earth
• Ambiguous about how the two populations will live coexist

The Happy One

• Inaho saves Asseylum
• Slaine comes to his senses, takes over Vers
• Asseylum declared "dead" and lives on Earth with Inaho
• Lemrina marries Slaine for real
• A truce is called and the two nations slowly back away from hostilities
• 100 years later, a tenative peace has finally been formed, and the last scene is a meeting between the grandchildren of the two couples

[Dauerlutscher]

All this does not excuse that Slaine is taking part in genocide...he was Saaz right hand man after all.

[frodonk]

I can already see it, Asseylum is living in peace on earth with only a few people from deucalion knowing about her existence, the Vers empire is in tatters, lemrina inaho and slaine are dead and every Vers person will be migrating back to earth or dying since the emperor has also died and all those aldnoah technology with him stopped functioning.

That's my ideal scenario anyway.

[Dauerlutscher]

Originally Posted by Terrestrial Dream

By your definition every war is genocide.

Every war that is intended to exterminate a group of people is indeed genocide.

Vers is trying to exterminate the Terrans and the killded millions or billions of civillians in a war they startet.

[Terrestrial Dream]

Originally Posted by Dauerlutscher

All this does not excuse that Slaine is taking part in genocide...he was Saaz right hand man after all.

And he killed Saazbaum, so does that he stopped genocide

[leelee85]

Originally Posted by Terrestrial Dream

And he killed Saazbaum, so does that he stopped genocide

If that's the case who the hell is the main villain?