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Tenzen12 · 2017-11-18, 11:41

Of course, but one thing is trade with both sides (like proper merchant of death) and other making exclusive deals with demon kind.

Deal you brought basically means "I am friend with demons so I am not gonna help you". This could work only if Makoto goes full blackmail for privileges and moneys in return not support demons in future, and because he wouldn't do that such pact would only worsen his relationship with hyumen.

J4n1 · 2017-11-18, 15:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

Of course, but one thing is trade with both sides (like proper merchant of death) and other making exclusive deals with demon kind.

Deal you brought basically means "I am friend with demons so I am not gonna help you". This could work only if Makoto goes full blackmail for privileges and moneys in return not support demons in future, and because he wouldn't do that such pact would only worsen his relationship with hyumen.

No, the deal is "demons are paying me not to attack them, also i have another contract to not attack hyumans".
Or just "I am contractually obligated to remain neutral in the hyuman demon conflict".

Tenzen12 · 2017-11-18, 16:44

But he didn't make any contract with hyumans, so unless Bug cooperated and were so kind to give Oracle saying he is safe it's same as if he made deal with demons only.

Plus as long as he doesn't make such thing both sides will continue curry his favor as much ad they can.

Sparteh · 2017-11-19, 16:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tenzen12

But he didn't make any contract with hyumans, so unless Bug cooperated and were so kind to give Oracle saying he is safe it's same as if he made deal with demons only.

Plus as long as he doesn't make such thing both sides will continue curry his favor as much ad they can.

And that as long as once can will be the moment when Trashmoki and his charm reaches MC's camp...

J4n1 · 2017-11-19, 16:36

Makoto could just claim to have a contract with adventurers guild to not get involved in the war against hyumans.
Root would back him up.

Tenzen12 · 2017-11-19, 17:22

Well, he could do that alright.I don't see single advantage of doing so but unlike deal with demons and spreading it among hyumans, there don't seem to be any demerits either.

Edit: One second there is one demerit, while there is no power that can make him keep word, breaking it would hurt his credibility badly. Such contract would limit his options without getting much in return then.

J4n1 · 2017-11-20, 04:39

The contract would in effect, only tie him as much as his agreement with the goddess would.
The benefit is giving him an excuse to not get involved, and letting hyumans know he is contractually stopped from acting against them would help ally their fears (not much, but some) about him.
The demerit is not really there because he has no intention to attack demons anyway.
And if he does want to act against demons, he can simply claim the demons broke the contract and hyumans will be happy, and at that point demons opinion won't matter.

Tenzen12 · 2017-11-20, 07:52

Makoto has no obligation to get involved and thus he doesn't need excuse not to. In other Hand in current conditions as long as he stay neutral he can ask anything and every major power will happily oblige "our of good will". But if he dus same after pledge neutrality thy would still do so but for cost of his reputation.

Also Goddess is under supervision so he has bit leaveaway Especially as there is no no need for transparency. But when it come hyumana supporting Tsige might as well be seen as undermining unity and weakening war potential. Even worse what if he one of these days hurt Tomoki for real? Good reputation is not something that can be forced through brute force no matter how much you have it.

J4n1 · 2017-11-20, 16:02

It's not about need, but use.
The contract would be nothing but a conversational shortcut.
Also, possibly give him useful stuff from the demons.

Thing is, Makoto does not need anything at this point, he could just hole up in Azora and never do anything again while armies of worshippers see to his every need.
So anything he does comes from is this fun, interesting or even marginally useful.

Tenzen12 · 2017-11-21, 07:47

Hmm that's lot of trouble just for getting conversational shortcut. Also making deal contract with adventurer guild wouldn't have any effect in relationship with demons. Not that it needs improving with Makoto being their saviour and stuff.

And yeah it's not like he need even interact with anyone outside Asora per se.

travelingbum · 2017-11-24, 07:50

well the vol 13 digest happened.

Hokoga · 2017-12-02, 20:39

New chapter out

Spoiler for "spoiler:

Vol.13 Cover

Images

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Images

Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload?

The One Above God · 2017-12-03, 05:56

It's funny how Jin looks like more of a main character than Makoto is in that cover.

El Rue · 2017-12-03, 06:50

Oh new raw chapter? Sweet.

Quote:

Originally Posted by The One Above God

It's funny how Jin looks like more of a main character than Makoto is in that cover.

Do remember that is one of the main points, he never was much to look at to begin with. Not even close to being visually MC material.

The One Above God · 2017-12-03, 12:21

I'm just talking about this cover though

. He does look rather MC-like in the volume 1 and 2 covers. Also, wouldn't average looking be very MC-like considering the trend of "average" protagonists?

But then again, with everyone in the world looking like actual main characters, he ends up looking like some mob character.

travelingbum · 2017-12-04, 06:38

another ch.

Spoiler for :

Tenzen12 · 2017-12-08, 00:25

So Makoto starting contemplate about value of human lives? Good. I was hoping his meeting with Hibiki and Tea Party incident will steer him in that direction. Genocide is overrated anyway.

As for Tomoe I hope she can win cleanly without lowering herself to the point of using magic or illusions. I doubt she will get better chance to put her swordsmanship to the test.

Morilinde · 2017-12-08, 03:07

Well good job with provoking a Tomoki fanatic by telling them he is weak or was beaten half dead

Hokoga · 2017-12-08, 21:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morilinde

Well good job with provoking a Tomoki fanatic by telling them he is weak or was beaten half dead

Spoiler for Chapter 291:

coded321 · 2017-12-08, 22:07

i'm a little confused as to how haruka is different from the other brainwashed tomoki followers. supposedly she is strong enough to maintain her free will, but still completely converted or brainwashed to worshiping tomoki, whom she had never even met. it just seems like a paradox to me, brainwashed yet still having free will.

2017-11-18, 11:41	Link #4401
Tenzen12 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2012	Of course, but one thing is trade with both sides (like proper merchant of death) and other making exclusive deals with demon kind. Deal you brought basically means "I am friend with demons so I am not gonna help you". This could work only if Makoto goes full blackmail for privileges and moneys in return not support demons in future, and because he wouldn't do that such pact would only worsen his relationship with hyumen. __________________ "I am convinced that life is 10% what happens to me and 90% of how I react to it" (Charles R. Swindoll) Last edited by Tenzen12; 2017-11-18 at 11:53.

2017-11-18, 16:44	Link #4403
Tenzen12 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2012	But he didn't make any contract with hyumans, so unless Bug cooperated and were so kind to give Oracle saying he is safe it's same as if he made deal with demons only. Plus as long as he doesn't make such thing both sides will continue curry his favor as much ad they can. __________________ "I am convinced that life is 10% what happens to me and 90% of how I react to it" (Charles R. Swindoll)

2017-11-19, 17:22	Link #4406
Tenzen12 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2012	Well, he could do that alright.I don't see single advantage of doing so but unlike deal with demons and spreading it among hyumans, there don't seem to be any demerits either. Edit: One second there is one demerit, while there is no power that can make him keep word, breaking it would hurt his credibility badly. Such contract would limit his options without getting much in return then. __________________ "I am convinced that life is 10% what happens to me and 90% of how I react to it" (Charles R. Swindoll)

2017-11-20, 07:52	Link #4408
Tenzen12 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2012	Makoto has no obligation to get involved and thus he doesn't need excuse not to. In other Hand in current conditions as long as he stay neutral he can ask anything and every major power will happily oblige "our of good will". But if he dus same after pledge neutrality thy would still do so but for cost of his reputation. Also Goddess is under supervision so he has bit leaveaway Especially as there is no no need for transparency. But when it come hyumana supporting Tsige might as well be seen as undermining unity and weakening war potential. Even worse what if he one of these days hurt Tomoki for real? Good reputation is not something that can be forced through brute force no matter how much you have it. __________________ "I am convinced that life is 10% what happens to me and 90% of how I react to it" (Charles R. Swindoll)

2017-11-21, 07:47	Link #4410
Tenzen12 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2012	Hmm that's lot of trouble just for getting conversational shortcut. Also making deal contract with adventurer guild wouldn't have any effect in relationship with demons. Not that it needs improving with Makoto being their saviour and stuff. And yeah it's not like he need even interact with anyone outside Asora per se. __________________ "I am convinced that life is 10% what happens to me and 90% of how I react to it" (Charles R. Swindoll)

2017-11-19, 16:36	Link #4405
J4n1 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2013	Makoto could just claim to have a contract with adventurers guild to not get involved in the war against hyumans. Root would back him up.

2017-11-20, 04:39	Link #4407
J4n1 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2013	The contract would in effect, only tie him as much as his agreement with the goddess would. The benefit is giving him an excuse to not get involved, and letting hyumans know he is contractually stopped from acting against them would help ally their fears (not much, but some) about him. The demerit is not really there because he has no intention to attack demons anyway. And if he does want to act against demons, he can simply claim the demons broke the contract and hyumans will be happy, and at that point demons opinion won't matter.

2017-11-20, 16:02	Link #4409
J4n1 Senior Member Join Date: Feb 2013	It's not about need, but use. The contract would be nothing but a conversational shortcut. Also, possibly give him useful stuff from the demons. Thing is, Makoto does not need anything at this point, he could just hole up in Azora and never do anything again while armies of worshippers see to his every need. So anything he does comes from is this fun, interesting or even marginally useful.

2017-11-24, 07:50	Link #4411
travelingbum Senior Member Join Date: May 2014	well the vol 13 digest happened.

2017-12-02, 20:39	Link #4412
Hokoga Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2012	New chapter out Spoiler for "spoiler: Lime & Levi vs. Haruka Makoto senses that Izumo is also in Kannaoi and heads towards him. Vol.13 Cover Images Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload? Images Sorry; dynamic content not loaded. Reload? Last edited by Hokoga; 2017-12-02 at 20:55.

2017-12-03, 05:56	Link #4413
The One Above God Kamijou Join Date: May 2014 Location: I'm Everywhere	It's funny how Jin looks like more of a main character than Makoto is in that cover. __________________ *"I'll destroy that illusion!"*

2017-12-03, 12:21	Link #4415
The One Above God Kamijou Join Date: May 2014 Location: I'm Everywhere	I'm just talking about this cover though . He does look rather MC-like in the volume 1 and 2 covers. Also, wouldn't average looking be very MC-like considering the trend of "average" protagonists? But then again, with everyone in the world looking like actual main characters, he ends up looking like some mob character. __________________ *"I'll destroy that illusion!"*

2017-12-04, 06:38	Link #4416
travelingbum Senior Member Join Date: May 2014	another ch. Spoiler for : Raidou decides use magic needle knocking them out instead of killing them this time. Shiki sends the students to Lime and Iroha.

2017-12-08, 00:25	Link #4417
Tenzen12 Senior Member Join Date: Jul 2012	So Makoto starting contemplate about value of human lives? Good. I was hoping his meeting with Hibiki and Tea Party incident will steer him in that direction. Genocide is overrated anyway. As for Tomoe I hope she can win cleanly without lowering herself to the point of using magic or illusions. I doubt she will get better chance to put her swordsmanship to the test. __________________ "I am convinced that life is 10% what happens to me and 90% of how I react to it" (Charles R. Swindoll)

2017-12-08, 03:07	Link #4418
Morilinde Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2016	Well good job with provoking a Tomoki fanatic by telling them he is weak or was beaten half dead __________________ You think you have defeated us? You think you have defeated the Master's Chosen? Your efforts are for naught, Prince! We are Domini! I am Domini! We are ethereal! we are eternal! We will fight until the heavens burn and the skies fall

2017-12-08, 22:07	Link #4420
coded321 He Who Games Join Date: Dec 2013 Location: the virtual world	i'm a little confused as to how haruka is different from the other brainwashed tomoki followers. supposedly she is strong enough to maintain her free will, but still completely converted or brainwashed to worshiping tomoki, whom she had never even met. it just seems like a paradox to me, brainwashed yet still having free will.