Russia invasion of Ukraine

[Jaden]

Originally Posted by Dextro

Ok, I'll bite: how is an official White House transcript of a phone call with the head of state of a foreign country propaganda?

Mind that the words were, and I quote: "But first, we would like you to do us a favor though".

Where's the "but first"? https://www.documentcloud.org/docume...h-Ukraine.html

Zelensky sounds like a big Trump fan, so maybe he was happy to help anyway.

I'd be more convinced if they could point to some aid package that was actually withheld by the white house, or some data that the Ukrainians delivered to Trump before receiving such an aid package. This phone call alone is kind of weak to justify an impeachment case, but that's just my opinion.

You are right in the sense that Trump did a bad thing, and I wouldn't call that in itself "propaganda". The propagandistic part, I suppose, was how much this action was hyped up as a treasonous, impeachable offense when it's really not such a big deal.

[Yu Ominae]

Them Ukrainian civilians are the unsung heroes.

Taking those captured tanks and APCs that were left in the ditch by the Russians.

[AnimeFan188]

A Russian Armored Train Has Joined The Invasion Of Ukraine

"Russian forces are using an armored train in Ukraine amid reports that their supply
lines are strained and under attack."

See:

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...ion-of-ukraine


====================================


Russian Police Arrest 13K Protesters as Ukraine Invasion Opposition Surges

"The number of protesters arrested comes as a recent poll released by jailed Kremlin-
opposition leader Alexei Navalny showed a rise in opposition to the Russian invasion of
Ukraine."

See:

https://www.newsweek.com/russian-pol...surges-1685965


====================================


Russian Air Force already lost four newest Su-34 fighter-bombers in Ukraine

"Russian Armed Forces reportedly have suffered heavy losses with 11,000 men dead
and over 1000 pieces of large hardware lost, including modern combat aircraft."

See:

https://defence-blog.com/russian-air...rs-in-ukraine/


====================================


Ukraine’s Use Of Stinger And Javelin Missiles Is Outstripping U.S.
Production

"Few realize that advanced Javelin anti-tank and Stinger anti-aircraft missiles are
backed by an aged and insecure production infrastructure, riddled with potential
bottlenecks, vulnerabilities, and supply challenges."

See:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/craigho...us-production/


====================================


Russian Officer Complains About Dead General and Comms
Meltdown in Intercepted Call

"Ukraine says it intercepted a call between two FSB officers discussing the death of a
top general and the failure of its encrypted comms system."

See:

https://www.thedailybeast.com/fsb-of...tercepted-call


====================================


Russia’s Disaster of a War in Ukraine Means China Won’t Invade Taiwan?

"The Lesson of Ukraine for China: Grabbing Taiwan would be Harder than it Thinks"

See:

https://www.19fortyfive.com/2022/03/...invade-taiwan/

[Key Board]

Is anyone vetting the foreign fighters going into Ukraine. Because I’m certain some of them have questionable morals, and is an international scandal waiting to happen

//

[Yu Ominae]

The Ukrainian Embassies are.

AFAIK, they're cutting out persons with strong criminal records and no military/police/paramilitary experience.

[AnimeFan188]

Russia's Invasion Of Ukraine Turns Two Weeks Old:

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...-two-weeks-old


================================


Russia's Military Losses in Ukraine Are A Gold Mine for US Intelligence:

https://www.newsweek.com/russias-mil...igence-1686055


================================


Ukrainians Share Intelligence About Russian Convoys Through Chatbot:

https://www.defenseworld.net/news/31...t#.YijcApaIZaQ


================================


Chernobyl Nuclear Plant's Power Lines Are Cut Raising
Concerns About Its Safety:

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...out-its-safety


================================


Poland’s ‘surprise’ MiG-29 offer for Ukraine not ‘tenable,’ US says:

https://breakingdefense.com/2022/03/...nfusion-in-us/


================================


Concern Rising That Putin Could Use Nuclear Weapons:

https://www.defenseone.com/threats/2...eapons/362913/


================================


The secret US mission to bolster Ukraine’s cyber defenses
ahead of Russia’s invasion:

https://arstechnica.com/information-...sias-invasion/


================================


Russia Intentionally Starving Ukrainians as Method of Warfare—
War Crimes Expert:

https://www.newsweek.com/russia-inte...arfare-1686432


================================


Ukrainian company offers $1 million to Russian pilots who
defect with fighters:

https://www.sandboxx.us/blog/ukraini...with-fighters/


================================


Italian G550 CAEW Aircraft Carried Out First Surveillance Mission
Over Eastern Europe Today:

https://theaviationist.com/2022/03/0...-caew-romania/


================================


The Next Few Weeks Of Fighting In Ukraine Will Be "Ugly" CIA
Director Warns:

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...director-warns


================================


UK plans to send anti-aircraft weapons to Ukraine, says Ben
Wallace:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...ys-ben-wallace


================================


Russia’s Rocket Barrages Reveal Bad Planning, Cruelty—and
the Absence of Crucial Skills:

https://www.defenseone.com/threats/2...skills/362911/


================================


Captured Russian AK-12 Rifles Appear To Be The Trophy Guns Of
Choice For Ukrainians:

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...nian-officials


================================


'Idiots': Russian military phone calls hacked after own soldiers
destroy 3G towers:

https://news.yahoo.com/russian-milit...104303881.html


================================


Zelensky Has Survived Over a Dozen Assassination Attempts,
Ukraine Claims:

https://www.newsweek.com/volodymyr-z...russia-1686329


================================


What happens if President Zelensky is killed or captured? Ukraine
and allies discuss political succession.

https://www.businessinsider.com/ukra...aptured-2022-3


================================


Romanian Air Force MiG-21 Lancer that crashed on Mar. 2, 2022
Reportedly Mistakenly shot down by Ukrainian S-300PS SAM:

https://theaviationgeekclub.com/roma...n-s-300ps-sam/


================================


How A Ukrainian Woman Used Pickled Tomatoes To Take Down
A Drone:

https://www.mashed.com/791782/how-a-...-down-a-drone/

[Yu Ominae]

Indian media picked up news of Indians already engaging the Russians, some in the Georgia Legion and others in the Ukrainian military' international legion. Around 500 joined, including military veterans and expats who settled in Ukraine.

They can be charged under Chapter VI, Section 121-130 of the Indian Penal Code. It states that "Whoever commits depredation, or makes preparation to commit depredation, on the territories of any Power in alliance or at peace with the Government of India, shall be punished with imprisonment of either description for a term which may extend to seven years, and shall also be liable to fine and to forfeiture of any property used or intended to be used in committing such depredation, or acquired by such depredation".

However, the law also states the law is used only if a "foreign Army in which India nationals joining is doing inimical things or is an adversary of India."

IIRC, this was used against Indians who joined jihadi groups.

[ramlaen]

Originally Posted by Dextro

Ok, I'll bite: how is an official White House transcript of a phone call with the head of state of a foreign country propaganda?

Mind that the words were, and I quote: "But first, we would like you to do us a favor though".

The former president of the USA was, in an official capacity, talking to a country in need of assistance and he made that assistance conditional on said other country finding dirt on his political opponent's son.

You mean the transcript that was released because it undercut the narrative being peddled by Democrat leadership.

You mean the political opponent who admitted to blackmailing Ukraine.

You mean the son being paid to gain political favoratism by Ukrainian companies in the exact sort of corruption that US aid was tied to stamping out by law.

Let us not forget that that happened and that it was taken to an impeachment trial where the president didn't get removed from office simply because his party had completely reneged on morals in order to ensure their team won

Let us not forget the only reason there was a Senate impeachment trial was simply because the opposing political party controlled the House and was desperate to remove him from office with numerous individuals who "morally" stated their desire to impeach the POTUS beforehand.

[mangamuscle]

Originally Posted by Yu Ominae

IIRC, this was used against Indians who joined jihadi groups.

I predict when this is over, they will be received like heroes for two simple reasons:

A) India wants to keep economic trade with Russia, but after their economy has been wrecked that would be pointless.

B) India wants to keep buying Russian weapons, but after their economy has been wrecked they can simply hire all the people with the required know how of how to do said weapons. If they don't the Chinese will.

I also predict that in the future when they examine putin's corpse, they will find extensive brain damage due to covid19.

Obviously the quickest way to end this war is putting putin out of his misery, but he is an assassin, he no doubt has taken all the measures to prevent such scenario, so this will drag on causing misery all around. The good news is that unlike lukashenko, putin has not been grooming a successor. The bad news is that he could live until 90 like Fidel Castro, maybe even more.

[Key Board]

Putin will probably be the fall guy, but the regime will make or find another replacement. Maybe that guy from Chechnya.

Also the sanctions will produce a lot of anger and resentment.The perfect breeding ground for populist militarism. Remember that Hitler rose to power following a broken and humiliated Germany

To actually deprogram a population you need to occupy them for a while and well, look how those played this past decades. outside of WW2 Germany has it been successful? And even in Germany, they still have parties like AFD

//

[Dextro]

Originally Posted by ramlaen

You mean the transcript that was released because it undercut the narrative being peddled by Democrat leadership.

You mean the political opponent who admitted to blackmailing Ukraine.

You mean the son being paid to gain political favoratism by Ukrainian companies in the exact sort of corruption that US aid was tied to stamping out by law.



Let us not forget the only reason there was a Senate impeachment trial was simply because the opposing political party controlled the House and was desperate to remove him from office with numerous individuals who "morally" stated their desire to impeach the POTUS beforehand.

That's not reality. What happened, and is in the transcript posted above, is that a sitting POTUS tried to blackmail a foreign country implying that military assistance was conditional on finding evidence of what you are now claiming as fact: that the then current sitting vice president had blackmailed that country (which, mind, was now being blackmailed) into favoring his son.

These are the facts. You can say whatever you want afterwards, it doesn't change reality.

Also: the motivations of the opposing party are irrelevant if the impeachment reasons were, in fact, reasonable! This shouldn't have been partisan but it was, and it wasn't the democrats that made it so. Or at least not on their own.

And, to circle back to this thread, all of this leads in part to the situation we're in today. Obama's weak response when Crimea was annexed was bad, the former president's fawning over Putin didn't help either.

Note that, however, the ultimate blame lies with the people in the Kremlin for ordering the troops in. That western countries let themselves reach the state where we are debating the morals of the politicians on either side of the aisle is just a very sad and unfortunate state of affairs (and not unrelated mind) but, in the grand scheme of things, nothing more than a distraction.

I already feel bad for taking the clear bait on the original post. Nothing comes from commenting on the absolutely insane last 5 years or so in US politics.

PS: I admit that I had misremembered the quote. The "But first" was indeed implied, not spelled out.

[AnimeFan188]

Widespread Destruction Now Common In Some Ukrainian Cities As
Russia's Invasion Enters Week Three

"Horrific scenes of massive devastation in urban areas are now becoming the norm in
Ukraine."

See:

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...out-its-safety


=================================


Russia reportedly strikes Ukraine maternity hospital as health care
attacks mount

"Russia has attacked health facilities, health workers, and ambulances, WHO says."

See:

https://arstechnica.com/science/2022...attacks-mount/


=================================


StarStreak: How Britain Plans to Help Ukraine Kill RussiaÂ’s
Helicopters and Air Force

"StarStreak can be shoulder-fired or mounted on a stand. Each StarStreak missile
weighs 30-pounds, and its range is 4.3-miles with a 3-mile ceiling. It is considered one
of the fastest air defense missiles in the world with a top speed of MACH 3.5 that can
track fast-moving jet fighters."

See:

https://www.19fortyfive.com/2022/03/...and-air-force/


=================================


Poland's "High Risk" Plan To Transfer MiG-29s To Ukraine
Shot Down By U.S.

"The Pentagon says there are better ways to bolster Ukraine's air defenses that are
less likely to provoke a Russian response."

See:

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...29s-to-ukraine


=================================


Russian military vehicles are flying Soviet hammer and sickle
flags in Ukraine

"Though the Soviet Union is known in the U.S. for its harsh authoritarian regime, human
rights violations, and poor economic conditions, there is a wave of nostalgia among
many Russians for the global power of the old empire."

See:

https://taskandpurpose.com/news/russ...-flag-ukraine/


=================================


New law allows civilians in Ukraine to shoot enemy fighters

"According to the law, which went into effect on Monday, foreigners and the stateless
living legally in the country can also obtain weapons and use them against Russian
soldiers involved in the ongoing attack of Ukraine."

See:

https://warisboring.com/new-law-allo...nemy-fighters/


=================================


After An Abysmal Start, Here Is How RussiaÂ’s Application Of
Airpower In Ukraine Could Evolve

"A rash of losses in Ukraine has increased questions about the competency and role of
the Russian Aerospace Forces."

See:

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...e-could-evolve


=================================


Russia Accused Of Using Air-Dropped Butterfly Mines To Block
Ukrainian Evacuation Route

"The PFM-1 does not look like a mine. It is plastic, five inches across and an inch high,
with asymmetric wings to glide to the ground like a sycamore seed without a
parachute. Inside the soft plastic skin is a detonator and a quantity of liquid explosive.
The detonator is triggered by cumulative deformation of the plastic skin: either a single
event such as a vehicle running over it, or a series of smaller events such as handling."

See:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidha...tterfly-mines/


=================================


Is Russia planning to use chemical weapons in Ukraine? The
signs are there.

"Defense officials are now warning that Russia may resort to using chemical or
biological weapons in Ukraine, following an uptick in Russian disinformation efforts
revolving around these sorts of weapons."

See:

https://www.sandboxx.us/blog/is-russ...gns-are-there/


=================================


Russian Officials "Live In Their Own Reality," Ukrainian Foreign
Minister Says After Failed Talks

"Top Ukrainian and Russian diplomats met for the first time today over the conflict,
which is now in its third week with no signs of abatement."

See:

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...ys-after-talks

[mangamuscle]

Originally Posted by Key Board

Putin will probably be the fall guy, but the regime will make or find another replacement. Maybe that guy from Chechnya.

Quite unlikely, this is not Nazi Germany where the people rallied behind their leader, this is an autocratic regime with putin at the center. This is similar to spain under franco regime or the ancient inca empire, power was so centralized that when the head of state died or was killed, the goverment crumbled because there was no one designated to fill in the void. Putin has made sure no one harbors any idea of taking his place.

Also the sanctions will produce a lot of anger and resentment.The perfect breeding ground for populist militarism. Remember that Hitler rose to power following a broken and humiliated Germany

Germany post-WWI was a western country (democratic, educated, free.press, law abiding) treated poorly by its pears. If russia continues to be an autocratic ruled country, people will know who are really to blame and its people will not harbor any real animosity towards the west, see cuba, venezuela & iran (remember the people behind 9/11 were from saudi arabia)

To actually deprogram a population you need to occupy them for a while and well, look how those played this past decades. outside of WW2 Germany has it been successful? And even in Germany, they still have parties like AFD

*coff* Japan *coff* Russians are well educated and would do well as a western country, that is what putin fears the most. Look at Spain, as soon as Franco died (and he WAS beloved by many of his citizens back then) they quickly modernized and became an integral part of "the west".

[ramlaen]

Originally Posted by Dextro

That's not reality. What happened, and is in the transcript posted above, is that a sitting POTUS tried to blackmail a foreign country implying that military assistance was conditional on finding evidence of what you are now claiming as fact
...
These are the facts. You can say whatever you want afterwards, it doesn't change reality.

Your opinions are not facts, as per the transcript the military aid to Ukraine was not dependent on Ukraine investigating the Bidens and the aforementioned favor was to find the missing Crowdstrike server.

that the then current sitting vice president had blackmailed that country (which, mind, was now being blackmailed) into favoring his son.

Biden is on video bragging about blackmailing Ukraine and Hunter had a very healthy salary for a figurehead job at a Ukrainian company he had no qualification to work for.

Also: the motivations of the opposing party are irrelevant if the impeachment reasons were, in fact, reasonable!

Partisan motivations of are highly relevant regardless of how fabricated the impeachment justifications were. A white juror finding an accused black man guilty of murder because he was black instead of because he did or did not commit murder is a travesty of the justice system.

This shouldn't have been partisan but it was, and it wasn't the democrats that made it so. Or at least not on their own.

I agree that it shouldn't have been a partisan event but that was a situation forced by people seeking to oust a political adversary.

And, to circle back to this thread, all of this leads in part to the situation we're in today. Obama's weak response when Crimea was annexed was bad, the former president's fawning over Putin didn't help either.

Note that, however, the ultimate blame lies with the people in the Kremlin for ordering the troops in. That western countries let themselves reach the state where we are debating the morals of the politicians on either side of the aisle is just a very sad and unfortunate state of affairs (and not unrelated mind) but, in the grand scheme of things, nothing more than a distraction.

I already feel bad for taking the clear bait on the original post. Nothing comes from commenting on the absolutely insane last 5 years or so in US politics.

Agree 100% to this.

[Jaden]

Originally Posted by Key Board
Putin will probably be the fall guy, but the regime will make or find another replacement. Maybe that guy from Chechnya.

Originally Posted by mangamuscle

Quite unlikely, this is not Nazi Germany where the people rallied behind their leader, this is an autocratic regime with putin at the center. This is similar to spain under franco regime or the ancient inca empire, power was so centralized that when the head of state died or was killed, the goverment crumbled because there was no one designated to fill in the void. Putin has made sure no one harbors any idea of taking his place.

I don't think Putin is irreplaceable, but it will take some time to promote a successor. If Putin were to die suddenly, it'd be very bad for Russia, because right now he's considered to be the only legitimate government official. Everyone else is just minions, orbiters, and crooks. And of course his opposition is totally suppressed, they would be unable to take power.

[Guardian Enzo]

We live in age when a government can't totally suppress information in a country the size of Russia. The nationalists will rally around their dear leader of course, but most Russians will blame him for not being able to shop on Uniqlo, go on twitter, or get an international flight. Make no mistake, he's been severely undercut already.

The issue though is what that means. There's no real political opposition - that's been crushed. And Russia does not have a long-standing tradition of democracy - they're used to being oppressed by one tyrant or the other. Resignation seems to be deeply ingrained in the national mindset. Putin is horrible, but replacing him isn't necessarily going to be better in the short-term.

[Yu Ominae]

Originally Posted by mangamuscle

I predict when this is over, they will be received like heroes for two simple reasons:

A) India wants to keep economic trade with Russia, but after their economy has been wrecked that would be pointless.

B) India wants to keep buying Russian weapons, but after their economy has been wrecked they can simply hire all the people with the required know how of how to do said weapons. If they don't the Chinese will.

Well we'll have to see assuming the volunteers from countries that don't allow them to join the Ukrainian military don't lock them up. Singapore came out strongly against this. There was even a debate on it on Reddit.

[mangamuscle]

Originally Posted by Yu Ominae

... volunteers from countries that don't allow to join the Ukrainian military don't lock them up.

That would be another case of a government conspiring against it's own long term interests. One thing this invasion has proven is that military experience is acquired on the battlefield (Sun Tzu was not a librarian) and no one knows when a country will need to fend off invaders with a battle tested military.

At the speed this conflict is escalating (Russia had as many dead soldiers in one week as the USA in two decades in afganisthan, expect them to surpass the numer the USA got in vietnam before the invasion is over) I expect this month:

Chemical weapons. Then en EU will stop buying russian oil, then the bridge putin built to connect to ukraine will have an "accident", then putin will implement the draft in Crimea. Oh, and putin will place one of his oligarchs in jail, to keep his bitches from moaning about returning to the prior status quo.

Meanwhile putin says (who knows if he believes) their economy will become more robust after some tweaking and the average russian thinks they will simply have less access to luxuries and that their pensions will be keep being paid. Now that they will stop supplying the west fertilizes, you can bet the west will not have a food surplus to see to russia and with sky high inflation government pensions will simply evaporate like in venezuela, coins will be but a memory in no time.

[Yu Ominae]

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-60705486

Well Moscow is "officially" upping the volunteer game of their own. From the looks of things, it looks they're bagging Syrians.

[Key Board]

The degree the bioweapon propaganda has spread among qanon and its adjacent groups seems to suggest that Russia might just do that next and blame someone else

Originally Posted by mangamuscle

Germany post-WWI was a western country (democratic, educated, free.press, law abiding) treated poorly by its pears. If russia continues to be an autocratic ruled country, people will know who are really to blame and its people will not harbor any real animosity towards the west, see cuba, venezuela & iran (remember the people behind 9/11 were from saudi arabia)

*coff* Japan *coff* Russians are well educated and would do well as a western country, that is what putin fears the most. Look at Spain, as soon as Franco died (and he WAS beloved by many of his citizens back then) they quickly modernized and became an integral part of "the west".

Maybe I read that incorrectly, but Cuba, Venezuela and Iran don’t have friendly relationships with the US. I’m not even sure if the US has an embassy in some of those countries.

If Russia continues to be an autocracy than a lot of people are just continue to eat up state propaganda. The thing about an autocracy is they are really good at defecting blame. Chinese companies will slowly replace western companies that pulled out, and they will be promoting their own talking points. China is far from neutral in this war.

//