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AC-Phoenix · 2020-03-07, 08:20

So... regarding the Death Apostle Ancestors:

Was them not existing as an organization in Fate retconned? Some reasons why I believe that to be the case:

Primate Murder for example, got referenced by Avenger, so we know that he is active. However, if Primate Murder is Primate Murder, then it likely also belongs to Altrouge, which seems to be the main difference between PM and

Spoiler for Major FGO spoiler:

Moreover, with the exception of /GO, the fate universe seems to be the perfect ground for PM to exist. GO seems to be the anomaly here, where everything went pretty much the perfect way for humanity.

Then, in Melloi Case files we see the Forest of Einmashe, meaning Einmashe himself also exist.

We see another DA, who is presumable also a DAA, in /Zero too, when Kiritsugu shoots him down along with the plane.
ORT too got referenced at some point, and lets not forget about Zeltrecht, who is a confirmed DAA

The general assumption, as to why they don't exist as an organization i, /Fate, seems to be, that they can never form their organization in a world where Servants exist. All the Church and the Mage association would have to do is summoning a Servant to take care of them.
And yet , there is a gaping hole in this argument in the form of Ilyasviel von Einzbern:
When she summoned Berserker, a few months before the grail war even started, she had to supply all the mana he used on her own.
Now from the original VN, we know that Ilya originally wasn't very close to Herakles at all and in fact kind of hated him as every single move he made caused her enormous pain.
Now, lets keep in mind that we aren't talking about a Magi with a normal amount of Mana here, but Ilya, whose circuits shocked even some talented mages.

Long story short: We know that summoning a Heroic Spirit without a grail helping the Master isn't an easy feat, and that it would put a lot of stress on the Master's body. Leaving only Pseudo and Demi Servants as an option.

Now to the Holy Church: Exorcists and Executors still exist, despite being not really needed when you can just throw a Servant against the DAs instead.
But if the various sub-departments in the Holy Church exist, they'd automatically rank each DA according to the level of threat they pose.

Another point is that there are DAAs who could probably tank Excalibur, such as PM and probably everything from Rank 10 upwards.

All this kinda brings me to the solution that they still exist as an organization, but just try not raising as much attention as they do in Tsukihime.

2020-03-07, 08:20	Link #5348
AC-Phoenix Detective Join Date: Aug 2010 Age: 36	So... regarding the Death Apostle Ancestors: Was them not existing as an organization in Fate retconned? Some reasons why I believe that to be the case: Primate Murder for example, got referenced by Avenger, so we know that he is active. However, if Primate Murder is Primate Murder, then it likely also belongs to Altrouge, which seems to be the main difference between PM and Spoiler for Major FGO spoiler: Fou/Cath Palug, when he is Merlin's pet/familiar Moreover, with the exception of /GO, the fate universe seems to be the perfect ground for PM to exist. GO seems to be the anomaly here, where everything went pretty much the perfect way for humanity. Then, in Melloi Case files we see the Forest of Einmashe, meaning Einmashe himself also exist. We see another DA, who is presumable also a DAA, in /Zero too, when Kiritsugu shoots him down along with the plane. ORT too got referenced at some point, and lets not forget about Zeltrecht, who is a confirmed DAA The general assumption, as to why they don't exist as an organization i, /Fate, seems to be, that they can never form their organization in a world where Servants exist. All the Church and the Mage association would have to do is summoning a Servant to take care of them. And yet , there is a gaping hole in this argument in the form of Ilyasviel von Einzbern: When she summoned Berserker, a few months before the grail war even started, she had to supply all the mana he used on her own. Now from the original VN, we know that Ilya originally wasn't very close to Herakles at all and in fact kind of hated him as every single move he made caused her enormous pain. Now, lets keep in mind that we aren't talking about a Magi with a normal amount of Mana here, but Ilya, whose circuits shocked even some talented mages. Long story short: We know that summoning a Heroic Spirit without a grail helping the Master isn't an easy feat, and that it would put a lot of stress on the Master's body. Leaving only Pseudo and Demi Servants as an option. Now to the Holy Church: Exorcists and Executors still exist, despite being not really needed when you can just throw a Servant against the DAs instead. But if the various sub-departments in the Holy Church exist, they'd automatically rank each DA according to the level of threat they pose. Another point is that there are DAAs who could probably tank Excalibur, such as PM and probably everything from Rank 10 upwards. All this kinda brings me to the solution that they still exist as an organization, but just try not raising as much attention as they do in Tsukihime. __________________ Those who forget about the past are condemned to repeat it - Santayana Sidenote: I'm seemingly too dumb for my current keyboard, so if you see the same character twice in a row, when it doesn't belong there just ignore it. Last edited by AC-Phoenix; 2020-03-07 at 08:47.